Glove: Legal or Illegal?

[Robmoz]

Originally Posted by IRISHMAFIA

Okay, I was addressing the plastic ties and only the plastic ties. But I still would not make a wholesale decision without actually holding the glove.

Even then, on what basis would I have in disallowing the glove? And I'm sure you are going to be informed this glove has been allowed in hundreds of games.

Considering the whipping action or just the distance of the protrusion, should players be required to trim the long extra pieces of leather lacing from the glove?

Let's talk about comparable situations. Should we ban sliding feet first on tags plays? After all the metal or poly spikes can be quite sharp.

All that said, yeah, if I thought the glove was a danger, I would probably have a discussion with the coach to see if s/he can adjust the glove to eliminate any safety issue there may be.

May be an old post, but yesterday...I had a player use a glove with the leather laces extending about 12 inches on all fingers like tentacles. Other than looking ridiculous I was wondering IF it posed a safety risk that needed my attention or not? Any thoughts?

[Manny A]

Originally Posted by Robmoz

May be an old post, but yesterday...I had a player use a glove with the leather laces extending about 12 inches on all fingers like tentacles. Other than looking ridiculous I was wondering IF it posed a safety risk that needed my attention or not? Any thoughts?

The ONLY issue I've ever heard when it comes to long leather laces is that they may pose a distraction when the pitcher has them. And that was in a LL Baseball game in my son's old local league, and it was done by a coach who looked for any excuse to get under the opposing team's skin.

As for it being a safety issue, I don't see how that's really a problem.

I suppose one could argue that 12-inch-long laces could give the defense an advantage when it came to tagging a runner. If on a swipe tag the fielder contacted the runner only with the laces while the ball was in the glove, would that be a legal tag? We do say a tag of a runner's ponytail constitutes a legal tag; how about when it comes to the glove? Hmmmmm...

[CecilOne]

Originally Posted by Manny A

I suppose one could argue that 12-inch-long laces could give the defense an advantage when it came to tagging a runner. If on a swipe tag the fielder contacted the runner only with the laces while the ball was in the glove, would that be a legal tag? ..

Are the laces part of the glove or merely an attachment?

[Manny A]

Originally Posted by CecilOne

Are the laces part of the glove or merely an attachment?

If they're being used to hold the glove together, they're part of it. I view attachments as items that serve no useful purpose, such as a lucky rabbit's foot or a dreamcatcher.

That said, are there any restrictions to attachments on gloves in the rules? I know that in LL, there is a restriction to attachments of "foreign material" to the pitcher's glove, where "foreign material" entails any item not attached by the manufacturer. No such restriction exists for other fielders.

I don't recall ever seeing anything similar in ASA, FED, or NCAA. The latter has something close under rule 3.7.2, where it says, "The use of any treatment or device that fundamentally changes the specifications of gloves is prohibited and renders the equipment altered and unsuitable for play." I wouldn't consider extra-long laces as a "device" that changes the glove's specs.

[Jake26]

Originally Posted by Manny A

I suppose one could argue that 12-inch-long laces could give the defense an advantage when it came to tagging a runner. If on a swipe tag the fielder contacted the runner only with the laces while the ball was in the glove, would that be a legal tag? We do say a tag of a runner's ponytail constitutes a legal tag; how about when it comes to the glove? Hmmmmm...

If the extra-long laces are considered part of the glove for purposes of a tag, have we not violated the rules regarding the size of the glove?

[Manny A]

Originally Posted by Jake26

If the extra-long laces are considered part of the glove for purposes of a tag, have we not violated the rules regarding the size of the glove?

I hate to answer a question with a question, but if that were to be the case, wouldn't the rules specify a maximum length for the laces?

IMO, glove sizes are solely for the purpose of providing a specification that limits the catching ability of the wearer on the field. If there was also a concern to limit the tagging ability, then the catcher's glove/mitt would also be limited.

That said, good luck actually seeing a fielder tag a runner with the glove's laces.

[jTheUmp]

FED baseball (and I'm sure softball also, although I don't have the rulebook handy) has a rule to the effect of "any equipment the umpire judges as unreasonably dangerous is illegal".

I'm guessing ASA has a similar provision, but I'm not an ASA guy.

If the cable ties on the glove are sharp enough to potentially injure a player, that glove isn't going to be used in my game.

[IRISHMAFIA]

Speaking ASA

Note, that my comments were base on general knowledge and I did state that if I thought they were dangerous, the glove probably would be removed from the game.

BUT ONLY ON THE POINT THAT IT WAS DANGEROUS TO ANOTHER PLAYER. Turn the zip tie around to where the connection was on the inside of the glove, and I have nothing.

For those who want to disallow the glove because it is being held together with plastic instead of leather, you have nothing to back it up other than made up rules. That isn't your job.

Those of you who are looking for reasons to declare a safety issue (i.e., long leather strands), you are picking nits and you probably agreed that Ralphie shouldn't get a bb gun for Christmas. Again, your job is to umpire the game, not be the police.

Do I think it is smart to have long strands of leather whipping around? No, but at what length do you draw the line? You know, leather isn't always soft and snipped edges of tanned hide can be sharp, especially some of cheap gloves on the market today. Maybe we need to start measuring the lace ends and checking them for rigid edges to make sure no one will ever be injured on a tag. And yes, I am being facetious, but it scares me how many umpires think it is THEIR game on THEIR field and it will be played by THEIR rules.

[EsqUmp]

Originally Posted by IRISHMAFIA

Speaking ASA

Note, that my comments were base on general knowledge and I did state that if I thought they were dangerous, the glove probably would be removed from the game.

BUT ONLY ON THE POINT THAT IT WAS DANGEROUS TO ANOTHER PLAYER. Turn the zip tie around to where the connection was on the inside of the glove, and I have nothing.

For those who want to disallow the glove because it is being held together with plastic instead of leather, you have nothing to back it up other than made up rules. That isn't your job.

Those of you who are looking for reasons to declare a safety issue (i.e., long leather strands), you are picking nits and you probably agreed that Ralphie shouldn't get a bb gun for Christmas. Again, your job is to umpire the game, not be the police.

Do I think it is smart to have long strands of leather whipping around? No, but at what length do you draw the line? You know, leather isn't always soft and snipped edges of tanned hide can be sharp, especially some of cheap gloves on the market today. Maybe we need to start measuring the lace ends and checking them for rigid edges to make sure no one will ever be injured on a tag. And yes, I am being facetious, but it scares me how many umpires think it is THEIR game on THEIR field and it will be played by THEIR rules.

So it is about being DANGEROUS, not about LIABILITY? I see. Makes sense now.