D3k... Again!

[bbsbvb83]

I'm sure this has been discussed ad nauseam in previous threads, but most of those discuss ASA. NFHS rules only, please:

First batter of the game. Uncaught third strike. BR turns around and takes five steps towards her team's third base dugout. All defensive and offensive players and coaches are oblivious to the situation. At this point, should she be declared out for abandonment, or should the home plate umpire wait until she enters the dugout?

[RKBUmp]

FED case play 8-1-1

F2 drops strike 3 with 2 outs . B3 starts toward the dugout but F2 does not throw to 1st. B3 then makes a quick dash to first. Ruling: If F2 does not throw to first, there is a chance B3 could reach first safely. However, B3 should be declared out if (1) she entered dead ball territory; (2) she did not reach the base by the time of the next pitch; or (3) the half inning ended because all infielders left the diamond.

[MD Longhorn]

Also ... please avoid the use of the term abandonment. It has a very specific meaning when applied to causing an out - and 95% of the umpires who want to rule someone "out for abandonment" have no idea when it applies - in addition, you can likely go your entire umpiring career and not have "Abandonment" ever actually happen.

[MNBlue]

Originally Posted by mbcrowder

Also ... please avoid the use of the term abandonment. It has a very specific meaning when applied to causing an out - and 95% of the umpires who want to rule someone "out for abandonment" have no idea when it applies - in addition, you can likely go your entire umpiring career and not have "Abandonment" ever actually happen.

Good job teasing the masses - care to expound?

[RKBUmp]

From NCAA softball rules.

12.8.5 If the ball is live and a runner, after reaching base safely, abandons
her base (for example, obviously heads toward her position or the dugout,
believing she was put out or that another batter/runner was put out to end
the inning).

[CecilOne]

But, in HS, s/he must leave live-ball territory to be out.

Also, unlike a coach at a National said, the batter can not be out for leaving live-ball territory, while still at bat. Abandonment only applies to BR & R.

[MD Longhorn]

Originally Posted by RKBUmp

From NCAA softball rules.

12.8.5 If the ball is live and a runner, after reaching base safely, abandons
her base (for example, obviously heads toward her position or the dugout,
believing she was put out or that another batter/runner was put out to end
the inning).

Great way to confuse the issue.

Guess I have to add: If you're working NFHS ball, don't refer to the NCAA softball rules.

[MD Longhorn]

Originally Posted by MNBlue

Good job teasing the masses - care to expound?

Sure - so many umpires saw the word abandonment in their rulebook in passing ... and have applied their own definition to it. Simply wandering off your base or some direction one might not normally expect is NOT abandonment in NFHS. We've all seen or heard about an umpire who ruled a runner out for abandonment when she did something odd thinking she was out or the inning was over - but not actually breaking any rule.

You have to actually LEAVE the field of play (or, I suppose, go play defense) to have abandoned a base.

[AtlUmpSteve]

Originally Posted by RKBUmp

FED case play 8-1-1

F2 drops strike 3 with 2 outs . B3 starts toward the dugout but F2 does not throw to 1st. B3 then makes a quick dash to first. Ruling: If F2 does not throw to first, there is a chance B3 could reach first safely. However, B3 should be declared out if (1) she entered dead ball territory; (2) she did not reach the base by the time of the next pitch; or (3) the half inning ended because all infielders left the diamond.

And, while I am ragging on NFHS Case Book plays, here's another idiotic (IMO) ruling. B3 is out in (1); because the rule says if she enters dead ball territory she is out.

But in (2) IF SHE ISN'T PUT OUT, ON A BASE, OR OFF THE FIELD, HOW THE HELL CAN THERE BE A NEXT PITCH??

And in (3), the solution is for the defense to leave the field without effecting the third out, so THAT makes her out and ends the inning??

JMO, but these are embarrassing.

[MD Longhorn]

Originally Posted by AtlUmpSteve

And, while I am ragging on NFHS Case Book plays, here's another idiotic (IMO) ruling. B3 is out in (1); because the rule says if she enters dead ball territory she is out.

But in (2) IF SHE ISN'T PUT OUT, ON A BASE, OR OFF THE FIELD, HOW THE HELL CAN THERE BE A NEXT PITCH??

And in (3), the solution is for the defense to leave the field without effecting the third out, so THAT makes her out and ends the inning??

JMO, but these are embarrassing.

I believe it's been discussed that number 3's purpose is to cover that instance where a runner abandons their base and heads straight to their position, someone throws them a glove, and the defense leaves the field - without the 3rd part, umpires would still be standing around waiting for the previous inning to end (until, I suppose, a member of the offense ran onto the pitcher's circle and picked up the ball, killing the otherwise live play!)

I agree that 2 is just stupid. Wondering if this covers some bizarre instance of the runner thinking they are out, not going anywhere... perhaps to a coach's box or something - possible in slow pitch adult ball I suppose.

[NCASAUmp]

Reported.

This is ridiculous, guys.