Dropped third strike?

[ronald]

I suggest crucial conversations. a lot of narratives going on and not genuine dialogue.

[IRISHMAFIA]

Originally Posted by ronald

I suggest crucial conversations. a lot of narratives going on and not genuine dialogue.

Okay, we are talking about something that has an origin which predates baseball or softball, but I'll start.

2 outs. 2 strikes on batter. No scoreboard, players not paying attention to umpire.

Uncaught third, batter doesn't run. Ball is thrown back to pitcher who gets on the rubber because she thinks there is another pitch. Coach, who is aware of the count, yells at pitcher to throw to first, which she does without disengaging rubber.

Well, for starts, why isn't the PU standing away from the plate with the mask removed awaiting a play? That isn't a batter standing there, it is a BR and a play imminent and the umpire's actions should be eminent.

This being the case, I'm with the blue from Nassau County (presumedly), there is no pitch to be had until the previous play is complete.

[Rita C]

Originally Posted by HugoTafurst

And if you ask me, she's kind of cute!!!

AWH gee. So are you.

Rita

[Rita C]

Originally Posted by Dutch Alex

Buy, loan, lease or steel (only I you can't afford it) a SB-rulebook (in the rule set by your fed.) read it and ask any question you want over here!!! We are here to help any umpire, regardless where you're coming from.

I have the rulebook and casebook for NFHS and Little League. But learning to officiate a sport also requires learning how to officiate with the book, so that when an odd situation surfaces, one can make a call and sell it.

With the emphasis on illegal pitches this year, I am learning a lot that just can't be taught just from a book.

Rita

[Gulf Coast Blue]

Originally Posted by Rita C

I have the rulebook and casebook for NFHS and Little League. But learning to officiate a sport also requires learning how to officiate with the book, so that when an odd situation surfaces, one can make a call and sell it.

With the emphasis on illegal pitches this year, I am learning a lot that just can't be taught just from a book.

Rita

I, like Hugo (I know his Real name).......a guy never forgets Hugo.........

I have seen you on the boards since the 90's and know that were asking an honest question.

Take the majority here.........you cannot have a pitching violation unless there is a batter. Just call the play as you see it.

Joel

[Rita C]

Originally Posted by Gulf Coast Blue

I, like Hugo (I know his Real name).......a guy never forgets Hugo.........

I have seen you on the boards since the 90's and know that were asking an honest question.

Take the majority here.........you cannot have a pitching violation unless there is a batter. Just call the play as you see it.

Joel

I've watched a ballgame with him at Tropicana Field!

Rita

[HugoTafurst]

Originally Posted by Gulf Coast Blue

I, like Hugo (I know his Real name).......a guy never forgets Hugo.........

I have seen you on the boards since the 90's and know that were asking an honest question.

Take the majority here.........you cannot have a pitching violation unless there is a batter. Just call the play as you see it.

Joel

Can you at least forget some of my dumber posts???

[clev1967]

Originally Posted by AtlUmpSteve

So, as an umpire, you aren't expected to use the proper RULEBOOK terminology? It's okay to call interference obstruction or vice versa whenever you make up a statistic like 90% of the time others use the wrong term?

Or, are you expected to read the rulebook, use the terms defined in the game in the way the rulebook uses them, and discuss the game with others using the proper terms? How about teaching the proper terms to the 90% by using them whenever you talk about them?

I have no problem using proper rulebook terminology when in a formal setting such as a clinic. But in normal conversation I am going to use what I use and for sure not going to chastise someone for not using "umpire-ese"

Side question for you. You get asked to be the radio guy for a local college or high school game because the normal person is out. Are you going to say things like "ground ball to F5 who throws to F3 for the out" and "base hit up the middle for B3 who is trying to stretch it to second, here comes the throw and oh the batter runner is out."

[HugoTafurst]

Originally Posted by clev1967

I have no problem using proper rulebook terminology when in a formal setting such as a clinic. But in normal conversation I am going to use what I use and for sure not going to chastise someone for not using "umpire-ese"

Side question for you. You get asked to be the radio guy for a local college or high school game because the normal person is out. Are you going to say things like "ground ball to F5 who throws to F3 for the out" and "base hit up the middle for B3 who is trying to stretch it to second, here comes the throw and oh the batter runner is out."

While I agreed that the tone of the post that prompted this discussion was a little off base, I agree with the sentiment - which is to use the proper terminology. Pointing out the difference adds to the knowledge of person who is open to learning. I'm pretty sure Rita will use the proper term from now on.

And I disagree completely with the rest of your above post.

1) This IS a SOFTBALL discussion forum. Although not a formal clinic, it is specifically directed at those who are interested in the proper way of administering softball. Knowingly using the improper term demonstrates a certain lack of respect for the game.

2) Your "side question" is pretty lame......

Like I said... the tone of the chastising post may have been off base, but pointing out the terminology was a teaching experience....

[JefferMC]

Originally Posted by Gulf Coast Blue

I, like Hugo (I know his Real name).......a guy never forgets Hugo.........

What??? Hugo's not his real name?

[AtlUmpSteve]

Originally Posted by AtlUmpSteve

Rita, you may consider this insignificant, but it really isn't.

There is no "rubber" in softball. If you really think you are a softball umpire, then you should call it what SOFTBALL calls it; a pitcher's plate. Just like no mound; that is the circle.

Respect the game, use the game's terminology.

That said, it really matters NOT that the pitcher happened to be in contact with he pitcher's plate while making a play. Not a pitch, therefore not an illegal pitch. The question, like the terminology, reeks of baseball, not softball.

To Rita, and anyone else insulted by the post above.

The last sentence was unnecessary, and inappropriate. I apologize for that; I had a bad day, was already short umpires (as an assignor), had to work 5 straight 16A games with teams that are ASA National caliber to free an umpire to work elsewhere, and STILL had a no-show on another site that got me cussed out numerous times that day.

Stopped and drank a few, then came home, shouldn't have posted that.

The rest of the post I stand behind. Use rulebook terminology in every possible setting, and especially only use defined terms as used in the rulebook.

[CecilOne]

Originally Posted by AtlUmpSteve

I had a bad day, .

thought so.

[Rita C]

Originally Posted by AtlUmpSteve

To Rita, and anyone else insulted by the post above.

The last sentence was unnecessary, and inappropriate. I apologize for that; I had a bad day, was already short umpires (as an assignor), had to work 5 straight 16A games with teams that are ASA National caliber to free an umpire to work elsewhere, and STILL had a no-show on another site that got me cussed out numerous times that day.

Stopped and drank a few, then came home, shouldn't have posted that.

The rest of the post I stand behind. Use rulebook terminology in every possible setting, and especially only use defined terms as used in the rulebook.

Thank you for the apology. I appreciate it.

Rita

[HugoTafurst]

Originally Posted by AtlUmpSteve

To Rita, and anyone else insulted by the post above.

The last sentence was unnecessary, and inappropriate. I apologize for that; I had a bad day, was already short umpires (as an assignor), had to work 5 straight 16A games with teams that are ASA National caliber to free an umpire to work elsewhere, and STILL had a no-show on another site that got me cussed out numerous times that day.

Stopped and drank a few, then came home, shouldn't have posted that.

The rest of the post I stand behind. Use rulebook terminology in every possible setting, and especially only use defined terms as used in the rulebook.

You da man!!!

[IRISHMAFIA]

Originally Posted by clev1967

I have no problem using proper rulebook terminology when in a formal setting such as a clinic. But in normal conversation I am going to use what I use and for sure not going to chastise someone for not using "umpire-ese"

Referring strictly to the paragraph above.

I find that when among folks that are not familiar with the proper terminology is the one time an umpire should be sure to use the correct words, phrases and rule citations.

How are they to learn if you fall into their world of inappropriate use of terms? I'm not suggesting an umpire correct them, but to respond with the appropriate terms, phrases and citations. Doing otherwise just creates confusion and frustration among the players when the encounter those who do it right. Don't believe me, ask those who have UIC a national tournament how many questions they get about "perceived" rules because that is what "Ol' Smitty" back home has been telling them for years.

One of my pet peeves is an umpire that calls pitches "deep" in the SP game especially if they make a motion over the shoulder with it. This is a serious issue when it comes to umpires who call the games and strike zones properly. It is either a ball or a strike. Don't think the word "deep" ever appears in the rules, yet hundreds of umpires, players and fans routinely use it even though there is no value to the term, but someone probably gets ejected every day because of the frustration felt when umpires will not call it "their way".

It is a disservice to the teams and fellow officials to not be professional which includes the proper usage of terms and phrases.