ASA Senior Ball - Second Plate

[IRISHMAFIA]

Runners on 2B & 3B, no outs.

Line drive to the outfield drops for a hit. R2 is was moving on contact while R1 hesitated to to make sure ball wasn't caught. F8 is up quickly with the ball and throwing home.

R2 catches R1 just as they both cross the commitment line, but the throw beats both as the catcher receives the ball while touching the original plate prior to either runner touching the second plate.

Is your call:

1) Both are out
2) R1 ruled out, R2 scores
3) No outs since neither runner was tagged
4) Huh? What do you mean there are two home plates?

[JefferMC]

Sure looks like (1), both are out.

But Irish wouldn't have posted it if it were that simple. What did I miss?

[CecilOne]

The key is that both passed the commitment line.

[Dakota]

Personally, my answer is 4.

[SergioJ]

Okay, I'll take a long-shot at this.

Since both runners passed the commitment line, and since the second home plate replaces the "tagging" of the runner, I vote for #1, double play. My thinking (huh?) is that this would be the equivalent to two runners coming in to home plate and the catcher tags both runners prior to either of them touching home plate.

Now Mike, I'm hoping that since you only gave us 4 choices, the answer is one of them and not a 5th choice that you left out. Or is the 5th choice R2 not only "caught up" with R1, but also passed him?


Serg

[celebur]

Originally Posted by SergioJ

Or is the 5th choice R2 not only "caught up" with R1, but also passed him?

There would still be two outs though--R2 out for passing, R1 out on the commitment play.

Around my neck of the woods, I only see two home plates in a variant of slo-pitch where the catcher must play the original plate and the runner(s) must go for the second plate. In effect, the second plate acts as the scoring line (safe line) in coed slo-pitch.

[BretMan]

I can't really see any other alternative under the rules than calling both runners out on this play.

[IRISHMAFIA]

Originally Posted by BretMan

I can't really see any other alternative under the rules than calling both runners out on this play.

I agree. As the rule is written, both should be out.

It just seems strange that on a play designed to be handled as a "force out" you can get more than one player out on a single act of touching one base.

However, by rule, the defense has no alternative since they cannot tag the runner. What would be expected, that the catcher touch the plate for one out, step off and then touch the plate a second time for the second runner?

This is a perfect example of what happens when you tinker with the rules of the game.

[CecilOne]

It is not a force out if there were runners only on 2nd and 3rd as in the OP.

[SergioJ]

Originally Posted by CecilOne

It is not a force out if there were runners only on 2nd and 3rd as in the OP.

Cecil, The "force out" is the fact that once both runners passed the committment line, then, by rule, they are "forced" to continue to the second home plate. If they go back to 3rd base, then, again, by rule, are out.

Serg

[youngump]

Originally Posted by SergioJ

Cecil, The "force out" is the fact that once both runners passed the committment line, then, by rule, they are "forced" to continue to the second home plate. If they go back to 3rd base, then, again, by rule, are out.

Serg

But it is a timing play, no?
________
buttsex Cams

[MD Longhorn]

Originally Posted by youngump

But it is a timing play, no?

What's your point?

Mike - I don't see this as being odd at all. Without the tinkered rule, both runners would be heading for home and F2 would be able to tag both.

[CecilOne]

Originally Posted by SergioJ

Cecil, The "force out" is the fact that once both runners passed the committment line, then, by rule, they are "forced" to continue to the second home plate. If they go back to 3rd base, then, again, by rule, are out.

Serg

OK that's true. As I said earlier, passing the line is the key.

[Dakota]

Originally Posted by mbcrowder

What's your point?

Mike - I don't see this as being odd at all. Without the tinkered rule, both runners would be heading for home and F2 would be able to tag both.

Or, they could stop and get in a run-down and one or more could be safe, score, etc.

[youngump]

Originally Posted by mbcrowder

What's your point?

Mike - I don't see this as being odd at all. Without the tinkered rule, both runners would be heading for home and F2 would be able to tag both.

Was just being pedantic, it's not a force out.
________
Vaporizer volcano