Warn First? Or Just Eject?

[chymechowder]

I'm a 5-year USSSA umpire in a men's league. Something happened last night that I'd never seen in 5 years of umpiring (or 10+ years of playing prior to that).

2nd inning. Home pitcher is airmailing; everything is coming in decidedly high. Visitors are just taking pitch after pitch.

After another such ball he snaps at me, "Where was that? High or inside?" I calmly replied "Both." He's shaking his head, holding his hands apart, gesturing for the what the strike zone is.

Next pitch crosses the plate at the batter's eye level. Ball two. He puts his hands up again, complaining, "Where did THAT miss?!" I said "It was high. Now let's go."

One of his teammates told him to just pitch. He angrily responded (loud enough for the whole infield to hear), "This guy's strike zone is the size of postage stamp! It's been that way all year!" I stepped out sideways from behind the plate and silently put my hands out in a firm, but nonconfrontational pose to suggest OK, that's enough.

He fired the ball into his glove and yelled "You. Are. AWFUL!"

I calmly pointed towards him, then the bench, and said "That's it. You're out."

First time I've ever been at a game when someone was ejected for arguing balls and strikes.

Before my question, quick background: the teams know they're not supposed to argue balls and strikes. Sure, we get the occassional batter rolling his eyes and stepping out of the box on a strike call he didn't like. Or the pitcher shaking his head and walking around the mound after one he thought he should've got. (These guys think they're in MLB sometimes, haha.)

And little stuff like that is fine with me. It never goes further than that. Also I never go "looking for trouble." Like if a runner's called out on a close play, he might spout off a bit on the way to the bench. Fine with me so long as it doesn't continue. I'm not down there to argue with the players. If they want to mumble something, I'm not going to ask them "What was that??"

So my question: was I too quick with the hook?

The way I saw it--there were four, separate exchanges, each louder and more combative than the last. I've now got a pitcher on the mound during the game barking at me. In my opinion, he'd gone WAY over the line, and it was too late to issue a warning.

Thanks in advance for any responses.

Oh one more thing that added to the absurdity of the situation. This was the last reg. season game. The home team had already clinched the #1 seed! This game meant nothing to them. And league rules say that any ejection automatically carries a suspension for the next game, which will be their first playoff game.

[umpirebob71]

You did warn him when you signaled "that's enough." I would have run him, as well. He threw himself out, you just gave him the message.

[wadeintothem]

"you.are.awful"

=

Gone

Dont give this one another thought.

You did fine. The fact you let the whole sentence out before tossing him shows great restraint.

[outathm]

You took a lot longer than a lot of people would have. Especially in SP.

[Bill S]

The "you are terrible" remark was personal.
If he would have said "your calls are terrible" I may have let him suffer some more.
He threw himself, good move.

[NCASAUmp]

You did it right. My only regret is that we have no trap doors on the field with which to dump players quickly. Preferably one that dumps them into a large Rancor pit.

You showed a little restraint. I would have tossed him as soon as he remarked my strike zone being the size of a postage stamp.

[AtlUmpSteve]

The only thing I can add is one way to try to avoid the confrontation.

Have the catcher answer him, instead of you addressing him directly. If the catcher says "They are high", or "It was too high", or even their version "Deep", there is a better chance he accept it and try to adjust. So, tell the catcher what you are calling, let him answer. Even if the catcher doesn't agree, it sounds like he is buying in.

There is a possible downside, however. When the catcher says "HE says they are high", the catcher is telling the pitcher he agrees with the pitcher, and not you. In that case, either they don't know, or your zone is off; and you may end up having to toss both.

[Texas Aggie]

"You. Are. AWFUL!"

I don't do softball anymore, but that's an automatic (fill in the penalty) in any sport. The only thing I might add is that I will under no circumstances let a player or coach get away with heavy gestures -- like you described with throwing up the hands. Talking with the hands or pointing back at something else is one thing; gesturing is another entirely. "Get the hands down; there will be no gestures..." and then deal with it appropriately if it happens again. You guys on the diamond might be a little more lenient than I am, but don't let it go too far.

In my view, whether an ejection is quick or not is irrelevant. The question is: was it deserved. Here, it clearly was.

[Welpe]

Originally Posted by Ref Ump Welsch

You showed a little restraint. I would have tossed him as soon as he remarked my strike zone being the size of a postage stamp.

Yup, I agree. I'm not going to let a player neuter me like that.

[KJUmp]

Originally Posted by Ref Ump Welsch

You showed a little restraint. I would have tossed him as soon as he remarked my strike zone being the size of a postage stamp.

Agree....he's gone right there.

He showed you up by gesturing with his hands what he thought of your strike zone.

Don't get me wrong..we all have a different point when we've had enough regarding arguing balls and strikes...and as others have replied it was a good and warranted ejection...no question about it.

Now I'm going to ask you to give the following some thought:
My reason for saying that he had to go at that point is this...what if it all stopped right there. He made the gesture with his hands, everyone on the field saw it, you chose to let it go, and this pitcher does no further complaining. What if later in the game the opposing pitcher did the same thing? Or a form either team gestured with their hands indicating displeasure with you zone? What do you do? Try to calm them down? Warn? Eject?

My point is this...the moment that pitcher showed you up by gesturing with his hands AFTER he had already yelled into you asking "where was that pitch"...every player there saw it, if you don't run him all those guys now think that they can get away with the same kind of BS.

[constable]

I made the switch from softball to hardball. I also do basketball. I concur. You tell me I'm awful and you're done.

I actually had someone say to me in a baseball game this summer

HC " You don't even know who's call it is- you're awful"
Me" You're outta here"
HC' At least I was in the game in the first place"
Me" Well I'm still here- get going"

I don't put up with personal attacks, neither should you. I too probably woulda dumped him with the postage stamp remark.

[chymechowder]

thanks for the responses. KJ, good point with your question. I think the reason I didn't toss him on the postage stamp line was that I was partially shocked to be hearing what was being said. we've never had anything close to that, arguments-wise.

the league still hasn't ruled on his appeal. (he appealed the automatic 1-game suspension that, if upheld, will keep him out of the first playoff game next week.)

[IRISHMAFIA]

You wouldn't believe how often I have issued an "arguing balls and strikes" warning this year prior to the 3rd inning, often in the 1st.

It seems to get the point across early and effectively.

[NCASAUmp]

Originally Posted by chymechowder

the league still hasn't ruled on his appeal. (he appealed the automatic 1-game suspension that, if upheld, will keep him out of the first playoff game next week.)

For that BS? I hope they give him 3 games just for appealing it. I know they won't, but it's still wishful thinking.

If you act like a d0uchebag, man up and admit it. Don't appeal it, admit it.