Need opinions please.

[DeputyUICHousto]

Line drive down the third base line. Ball lands directly on the line. Someone from the stands yells "Foul Ball!" Batter stops and is thrown out. Fan interference? What would you call?

[NCASAUmp]

Originally Posted by DeputyUICHousto

Line drive down the third base line. Ball lands directly on the line. Someone from the stands yells "Foul Ball!" Batter stops and is thrown out. Fan interference? What would you call?

Hang on, flipping through the book.

Almost there...

Oh wait...

There is no special "DMR" rule in ASA.

I've got nothing. Spectator interference only pertains to the defense's ability to make a play (8-2-N and RS #33).

[IRISHMAFIA]

Originally Posted by DeputyUICHousto

Line drive down the third base line. Ball lands directly on the line. Someone from the stands yells "Foul Ball!" Batter stops and is thrown out. Fan interference? What would you call?

If it is a defender, it could be obstruction. Otherwise, it is nothing, but a DMR.

[HugoTafurst]

Originally Posted by DeputyUICHousto

Line drive down the third base line. Ball lands directly on the line. Someone from the stands yells "Foul Ball!" Batter stops and is thrown out. Fan interference? What would you call?

No call on the shout from the stands.... Out on the play.


No comment on the idea that Fan Interference would even be considered....

I agree with no call on the shout from the stands, but would any of you consider some kind of preventative officiating by saying some type of general statement to the fans or even the coach or manager of the team to share with the fans? Something to the effect of "don't do that again"?

Since I do slow-pitch only, I would probably have a word with the manager/captain of both teams, asking them to let their fans know that shouting this kind of thing is not really appropriate, and to refrain from it. I don't know, but something tells me if this doesn't get nipped in the bud this time, someone is bound to have some serious problems down the road.

[NCASAUmp]

Originally Posted by Ref Ump Welsch

I agree with no call on the shout from the stands, but would any of you consider some kind of preventative officiating by saying some type of general statement to the fans or even the coach or manager of the team to share with the fans? Something to the effect of "don't do that again"?

Since I do slow-pitch only, I would probably have a word with the manager/captain of both teams, asking them to let their fans know that shouting this kind of thing is not really appropriate, and to refrain from it. I don't know, but something tells me if this doesn't get nipped in the bud this time, someone is bound to have some serious problems down the road.

The only times I would ever acknowledge an act by a fan are if A) it actually is, by rule, spectator interference or B) the actions by the fan present a serious safety hazard or C) if I hear a direct threat ("I'm kicking your a$$ in the parking lot after the game, blue!").

We've actually had this discussion many times on this forum, and I believe the general consensus was to have someone else remove the fan (either the athletics director, tournament director, home team coach, security, or some other appropriate person). Never, EVER turn around to confront a fan. You're wasting your breath, and you're sinking to their level.

Originally Posted by NCASAUmp

We've actually had this discussion many times on this forum, and I believe the general consensus was to have someone else remove the fan (either the athletics director, tournament director, home team coach, security, or some other appropriate person). Never, EVER turn around to confront a fan. You're wasting your breath, and you're sinking to their level.

What if it were a city rec league at which there is none of the people you've listed and I've highlighted in red? I think I would rather say something to both managers and have them say something to their own fans, than to let it go and then have some kind of fracas happen in the parking lot in which the cops then pull us off the field to interview us about what occurred during the game.

[IRISHMAFIA]

Originally Posted by Ref Ump Welsch

What if it were a city rec league at which there is none of the people you've listed and I've highlighted in red? I think I would rather say something to both managers and have them say something to their own fans, than to let it go and then have some kind of fracas happen in the parking lot in which the cops then pull us off the field to interview us about what occurred during the game.

Before we get into checking out the "what ifs" involving the sports guy from the local Coupon Saver/Auto Trader weekly and the grandmother sitting in the car just beyond the OF fence, I don't give a damn who it is. If not a participant of that specific game which only includes players, coaches and assistants, it has no bearing on the game.

[NCASAUmp]

Originally Posted by Ref Ump Welsch

What if it were a city rec league at which there is none of the people you've listed and I've highlighted in red? I think I would rather say something to both managers and have them say something to their own fans, than to let it go and then have some kind of fracas happen in the parking lot in which the cops then pull us off the field to interview us about what occurred during the game.

I think that there is somehow this perception that we are the policemen of the park, either put upon us by the participants, those in charge of the league, the fans, ourselves, or some combination of all four.

This perception is, however, completely false. We are not the policemen of the park, we are the umpires of the game. And while our role is one of authority, our authority is not omnipotent, though there are times when we wish that it could be.

Addressing the concern you specifically address in this post, well, all I can say is that it's not our job to prevent every bad thing from happening. Sure, we can attempt to head things off at the pass by working craftily within the framework we're given, but realize that doing so is not our mandate. If a fan is a jerk, oh well. If they're that much of a pain, go to the captain of the team the jerk is "cheering" for and have them deal with it. If the game is completely falling apart and mayhem will ensue, tell the coach he can either deal with said jerk, or you're suspending the game until the police show up to take the jerk away.

Most commonly, you'll have someone on the other team that will get upset. Pull their captain aside, tell him/her that you acknowledge the problem, but that they need to just laugh it off and ignore it.

Contrary to popular belief, we're not the police. We're umpires.

[NCASAUmp]

Originally Posted by Ref Ump Welsch

What if it were a city rec league at which there is none of the people you've listed and I've highlighted in red? I think I would rather say something to both managers and have them say something to their own fans, than to let it go and then have some kind of fracas happen in the parking lot in which the cops then pull us off the field to interview us about what occurred during the game.

Another thing you can do is talk to the people running the league. They may not be aware that there is a problem, and this is something that they should be handling. Most of the time, they'll simply show up and watch the game from a distance to see what's going on, and I have seen some results when they do this.

Also, if your bosses in the city league have the "umpire is a policeman" perception as well (it's happened to me before), your answer to them is simple.

I'm not a police officer. I've not been certified in how to properly restrain someone. And frankly, my paycheck isn't enough for me to have a lawyer on retainer.

They'll get the hint.

[Steve M]

Originally Posted by NCASAUmp

I think that there is somehow this perception that we are the policemen of the park, either put upon us by the participants, those in charge of the league, the fans, ourselves, or some combination of all four.

This perception is, however, completely false. We are not the policemen of the park, we are the umpires of the game. And while our role is one of authority, our authority is not omnipotent, though there are times when we wish that it could be.

Addressing the concern you specifically address in this post, well, all I can say is that it's not our job to prevent every bad thing from happening. Sure, we can attempt to head things off at the pass by working craftily within the framework we're given, but realize that doing so is not our mandate. If a fan is a jerk, oh well. If they're that much of a pain, go to the captain of the team the jerk is "cheering" for and have them deal with it. If the game is completely falling apart and mayhem will ensue, tell the coach he can either deal with said jerk, or you're suspending the game until the police show up to take the jerk away.

Most commonly, you'll have someone on the other team that will get upset. Pull their captain aside, tell him/her that you acknowledge the problem, but that they need to just laugh it off and ignore it.

Contrary to popular belief, we're not the police. We're umpires.

Ya know, as umpires, we're not on the field to make sure that life is fair. We're there to enforce the rules as written or as interpreted by the "powers that be". I agree - we're not police (I'm not sure you could pay me enough to handle their job anyway), we're umpire.

[luvthegame]

Originally Posted by DeputyUICHousto

Line drive down the third base line. Ball lands directly on the line. Someone from the stands yells "Foul Ball!" Batter stops and is thrown out. Fan interference? What would you call?

How about..runner on 2b off on pitch...ground ball to deep SS who tries to throw runner out at 1b...BR is safe at 1b. Fan yell's "out" (umpire yell's safe)and runner from 2b slows up or stops a few feet from home...first baseman throws to catcher who tags runner from 2b out...a few feet from home?

We had an out....runner was embarrassed...no other players or managers said a word to the umpires....but they did converse with the runner from 2b.

Fan interference was never a consideration.

[NCASAUmp]

Originally Posted by luvthegame

How about..runner on 2b off on pitch...ground ball to deep SS who tries to throw runner out at 1b...BR is safe at 1b. Fan yell's "out" (umpire yell's safe)and runner from 2b slows up or stops a few feet from home...first baseman throws to catcher who tags runner from 2b out...a few feet from home?

We had an out....runner was embarrassed...no other players or managers said a word to the umpires....but they did converse with the runner from 2b.

Fan interference was never a consideration.

Nor should it have been under consideration. It's no different from the OP.

[DeputyUICHousto]

the OC wanted some type of fan interference. I told him control of fans was not my responsibility and the out would stand. He wasn't happy but he got over it.

[CecilOne]

Originally Posted by Ref Ump Welsch

What if it were a city rec league at which there is none of the people you've listed and I've highlighted in red? I think I would rather say something to both managers and have them say something to their own fans, than to let it go and then have some kind of fracas happen in the parking lot in which the cops then pull us off the field to interview us about what occurred during the game.

Your red highlight "(either the athletics director, tournament director, home team coach, security, or some other appropriate person)" includes home team coach. Both HC if needed. But only if a real problem as noted earlier "(A) it actually is, by rule, spectator interference or B) the actions by the fan present a serious safety hazard or C) if I hear a direct threat)"