Strike zone defined by ground?

[gumpire]

Most of my posts on here have been met with "Welcome to rec league" or "Welcome to slow-pitch" but I'm gonna try again and see what other, more experienced umps, have to tell me about this:

My nephew recently joined a slow-pitch league in the NE and he argued continuously with his dad regarding where the strike zone was located....he insisted it was defined by where the ball landed. My brother called me and asked me just to be sure of his knowledge and I repeated what was in rule 1.

Out of curiosity tonight, I asked the coaches of all 3 of my games to define the strike zone for me. 2 of the 6 didn't have a clue how to describe it but ultimately agreed with the other 4 that it was defined as: hitting the ground behind the plate, between the inside lines of the batters box, but in front of the back lines of the batters box.

I was actually shocked to learn that they truly believed that was the correct answer. However, I was extremely relieved to know that I really haven't been that bad at strikes and balls for the last 2 seasons!!!

It a local parks and rec league and I'm not sure if I should just continue to call the REAL strike zone, or afdjust my calls and give-in to the players (and apparently many other local umps) and avoid some of the *****ing.

Thoughts?

[Welpe]

I guess it depends if you're playing with an actual strike zone or with a mat.

[DeputyUICHousto]

I asked a batter during league ball last night if he knew what the strike zone was...his response "I have no clue, I swing at everything"..So I said, "Ok, I'll call every pitch you take a strike!" "You can't do that".

Player rule knowlege never ceases to amaze me...actually its what they think they know that kills me.

The only slow pitch players who know what the freaking strike zone is are the ones you see playing every weekend and traveling on someone's dime to play in those tournaments. The rec players have that "mat" mentality even if there is no mat.

Matter of fact, the lack of rules knowledge at the rec level scares the H*** out of me. Even worse is the lack of fundamental knowledge and skills that can pop up at this level. I had a coed rec game the other day where the shortstop and first baseman (both male) had to do ALL of the infield work because the ladies at 2nd and 3rd base had no clue what they were doing. Keep in mind USSSA ball here, so think about where I'm supposed to be positioned. Scary huh? If it were ASA ball, I wouldn't have a worry in the world. So for one game, I said horse hockey and used the ASA base mechanics. My partner said what are you doing??? I said staying alive!!!

[IRISHMAFIA]

Originally Posted by gumpire

Most of my posts on here have been met with "Welcome to rec league" or "Welcome to slow-pitch" but I'm gonna try again and see what other, more experienced umps, have to tell me about this:

My nephew recently joined a slow-pitch league in the NE and he argued continuously with his dad regarding where the strike zone was located....he insisted it was defined by where the ball landed. My brother called me and asked me just to be sure of his knowledge and I repeated what was in rule 1.

Your nephew is incorrect. I know that may be a shock to your nephew, but he will outgrow it.

Out of curiosity tonight, I asked the coaches of all 3 of my games to define the strike zone for me. 2 of the 6 didn't have a clue how to describe it but ultimately agreed with the other 4 that it was defined as: hitting the ground behind the plate, between the inside lines of the batters box, but in front of the back lines of the batters box.

Actually, at the higher levels, the expect a ball which lands between the BB lines to be called a strike if in the zone. Unlike many FP folks, they understand (and that is scary by itself) that if the ball is between those lines, some part of it probably crossed the plate.

I was actually shocked to learn that they truly believed that was the correct answer. However, I was extremely relieved to know that I really haven't been that bad at strikes and balls for the last 2 seasons!!!

Congrats! How were you before than?

It a local parks and rec league and I'm not sure if I should just continue to call the REAL strike zone, or afdjust my calls and give-in to the players (and apparently many other local umps) and avoid some of the *****ing.

Thoughts?

Work with the real strike zone. If you don't, you will become accustomed to using the faux zone and really get screwed up when working a real game.

[SC Ump]

Originally Posted by gumpire

2 of the 6 didn't have a clue how to describe it but ultimately agreed with the other 4 [who were wrong]...

Originally Posted by gumpire

my posts on here have been met with "Welcome to rec league" or "Welcome to slow-pitch"

I've got nothing to add.... except welcome to the board.

But seriously, where it lands can give an indication of where it was when it crossed the plate, but officially it does not matter at all (as long as it does not land on the plate.) As others have noted, the strike zone is still that three dimensional area of space as defined by the rule book.

[NCASAUmp]

Originally Posted by gumpire

In a local parks and rec league and I'm not sure if I should just continue to call the REAL strike zone, or adjust my calls and give-in to the players (and apparently many other local umps) and avoid some of the *****ing.

Continuing to call it the way the players think it should be called will only perpetuate the myth, not squash it (though really, could it ever be squashed?). This myth started with mat ball, something that I wish would just die. Unfortunately, that's not my call.

I call the strike zone the way ASA tells me to. Period. Don't like it, batter? STFU and play ball. Do I catch hell from some idiots when I call strike 3 on a 6' pitch that the catcher caught at their stomach? Of course!

Do I care? No.

[DeputyUICHousto]

Originally Posted by IRISHMAFIA

Actually, at the higher levels, the expect a ball which lands between the BB lines to be called a strike if in the zone. Unlike many FP folks, they understand (and that is scary by itself) that if the ball is between those lines, some part of it probably crossed the plate.

Irish,

I have to agree. The "Adult T-Baller's" really do like it when you call corners. One of the problems I've noticed with the "Adult T-Baller's" is that most play USSSA and when they come to play ASA they aren't used to that 12' arc. They get used to it in a hurry though.

[ronald]

between the lines is one thing and on the line is another thing.

Also depends on how close the inner edge of the line is to the plate. If it is 5 or six inches, then the ball can fit between the two and not nick the plate. Do not believe, ask Bart Hadley.

[IRISHMAFIA]

Originally Posted by ronald

between the lines is one thing and on the line is another thing.

Also depends on how close the inner edge of the line is to the plate. If it is 5 or six inches, then the ball can fit between the two and not nick the plate. Do not believe, ask Bart Hadley.

And how many pitches in any game come in an pass the plate on a parallel path to the sides?

[Umpteenth]

Originally Posted by gumpire

It a local parks and rec league and I'm not sure if I should just continue to call the REAL strike zone, or afdjust my calls and give-in to the players (and apparently many other local umps) and avoid some of the *****ing.

Thoughts?

In my opinion, I'm being paid to call a specific set of rules. That is my job. If I deviate from that set of rules, then I don't deserve to be paid for my services, because I am not providing that particular service.

Read the rules, study the rules, call the rules. No one can fault your work if you do this. And you will know you did the best you could do.

Originally Posted by ronald

between the lines is one thing and on the line is another thing.

Also depends on how close the inner edge of the line is to the plate. If it is 5 or six inches, then the ball can fit between the two and not nick the plate. Do not believe, ask Bart Hadley.

Then you haven't seen the curve balls I'm seeing in USSSA Class C and D men's...and Class C womens. These folks can throw some sliders that make for some great strikes. Many of these people play in ASA too, so you'll see your share eventually if you haven't.