foul tip or foul ball

[Dakota]

Originally Posted by snorman75

It needs to be direct to mitt or hand. It needs to be caught "clean". Anything else is a foul ball.

This is a foul ball since the ball did not go directly to either the mitt or hand.

It didn't?

Originally Posted by shipwreck

...the batter hits ball directly and sharply back. Ball first contacts the catcher's mitt...

You have a significant misunderstanding of the foul tip rule. The batted ball DOES need to go directly back and first contact the catcher's hand or glove, but after it does that, the ball does NOT need to be caught "clean" - it merely needs to be legally caught by the catcher.

[cruzercapt]

Originally Posted by Dakota

You have a significant misunderstanding of the foul tip rule. The batted ball DOES need to go directly back and first contact the catcher's hand or glove...

True,

but after it does that, the ball does NOT need to be caught "clean" - it merely needs to be legally caught by the catcher.

Not true. The legal catch must occur before the ball contacts anything else, including the chest protector, mask, umpire, etc.

Additionally, a ball trapped against the chest protector is not legally caught.

David

[bluezebra]

Originally Posted by cruzercapt

True,



Not true. The legal catch must occur before the ball contacts anything else, including the chest protector, mask, umpire, etc.

Additionally, a ball trapped against the chest protector is not legally caught.

David

Try reading the FED rule.

Bob

[cruzercapt]

Originally Posted by bluezebra

Try reading the FED rule.

Bob

I take it that there is a difference between FED and the rest of the softball world?

Can somebody please post the rule reference/quote?

Thanks

David

[snorman75]

It is a foul tip. The reason why is the word "and" in the rule, not "then".

To be a foul tip it says the ball need to be directly to the mitt or hand and legally caught. Once the ball does anything but go directly to the mitt or hand the first part rule is no longer fulfilled and we have a foul ball.

P.S. using ASA, sorry no FED book.

[Dakota]

From NFHS Case Book:

2.25 COMMENT: Determining when a ball becomes dead on a foul is sometimes tricky....(4) A pitch touches the bat of
B2. In (a), it goes directly to the catcher's glove then caroms against her protector and rebounds into her hand or glove; or (b) it goes directly to catcher's protector or mask and rebounds into her hand or glove. In (a), it is a foul tip and a catch. The ball remains live. In (b), the ball becomes dead when it touches the body of F2.

From the ASA Case Book:

PLAY 1-59
The ball goes directly from the bat and (a) first touches F2’s glove or hand and then rebounds to the chest protector, or (b) strikes F2’s body, protective equipment or the umpire. In both cases, the ball rebounds into the glove or hand of F2 and is securely held.
RULING: In (a) a foul tip and a strike is ruled. In (b) it is a foul ball. The ball cannot be a foul tip if it first touches anything other than the catcher’s glove or hand. (1-FOUL BALL-G; 1-FOUL TIP; 7-4D)

As I said, you (two) have a significant misunderstanding of the foul tip rule.