Countdown Timer

[wadeintothem]

Originally Posted by WestMichBlue

Well, let's see - I have about 40' to 50' of fence behind me up to 6' high where I may hang my 2" x 3" timer. So my timer represents an area of 6 sq inch against a target area of 45,000 to 50,000 sq inches. That is like 0.00012 % of the area. Probability of a 12 sq in softball hitting it? ? ? ?


Of course, if Murphy is at bat, the timer will get hit every game!


WMB

Ok enough with the math already! Wizard Math Brain...

[wadeintothem]

Originally Posted by Skahtboi

The ball can't hit it, the mask protects it. It is on the back side of the temple guard, very well protected. I have taken shots there and it, and I, and the players, are all fine. Now a timer on a fence can easily be hit, shatter into a million pieces that go flying everywhere.

So far the only time its been hit.. walking to a game.. I hear "HEADSSSS!" .. instinctively put my hand over my dome, the ball hits my hand, which had my timer in it, which fell to the ground shattering...

Originally Posted by wadeintothem

So far the only time its been hit.. walking to a game.. I hear "HEADSSSS!" .. instinctively put my hand over my dome, the ball hits my hand, which had my timer in it, which fell to the ground shattering...

Is there a "Murphy" somewhere in your name?

[wadeintothem]

Originally Posted by GrumpUmp

Is there a "Murphy" somewhere in your name?

I think so.. I been saying it, I'm gonna be the John Olerud of umpiring if it keeps up. I'm gonna wear a helmet.

[JefferMC]

I've seen timers on the fence hit and broken. My daughter fouled one off into such a timer last July, but I think she only broke the clip (i.e. the timer still functioned) It wasn't the first I've seen that happen to.

BTW, the softball isn't 12 sq inches. The surface area would be 45.84 square inches for a 12 linear inch diameter ball. The cross section would be 11.46 square inches (which is a lot closer to 12 inches than I thought it would be before I did the math).

[DaveASA/FED]

Ok math lesson is getting crazy here, but since the is only 1 area of the ball coming at the timer (back side will never hit it only profile of the ball) then we really have about 18 sq inches coming at it....2*pie*r but some of that profile is reduced due to the sperical nature of the ball the outer edge of the ball could not contact the timer as the front edge will hit the fence thus keeping the edge away from the timer. So we need to know the distance that the timer is held away from the fence so we can calculate the actual square inches of ball that could contact the timer.....ok I give up. Use the timer hang it on the fence in line with the front right (toward plate) and back left of the right handed batters box extended to the fence. Have the offiical score keeper write down the start time as a back up, use the same watch...or cell phone, which I like better as most of their times are derived from the cell company, or a sync with a computer, so they are a lot harder to modify depending on your teams status when time is close. make sure everyone knows the start time (as a back up only).

[SRW]

I can guaran-frickin-tee you that if any of you come work games in Seattle, you'd better leave your kitchen timers in the kitchen, and not have them clipped to the backstop. If we've got a time limit (and we typically do), we tell the coaches that they can start their own clock with the first pitch, but our watch is official. Tell the coaches about an inning before time's about to expire that "this'll probably be the last inning" and there's no problem.

I've got two timers that I've removed from the back side of fences from umpires in tournaments I've UIC'd. (and I'm pretty sure bkbjones has some too for the same thing). If any of you need a new one, let me know, I'll send one to you. Just don't bring it back.

[Skahtboi]

Originally Posted by SRW

I can guaran-frickin-tee you that if any of you come work games in Seattle, you'd better leave your kitchen timers in the kitchen, and not have them clipped to the backstop. If we've got a time limit (and we typically do), we tell the coaches that they can start their own clock with the first pitch, but our watch is official. Tell the coaches about an inning before time's about to expire that "this'll probably be the last inning" and there's no problem.

I've got two timers that I've removed from the back side of fences from umpires in tournaments I've UIC'd. (and I'm pretty sure bkbjones has some too for the same thing). If any of you need a new one, let me know, I'll send one to you. Just don't bring it back.

Another reason I don't like the kitchen time thing. Appearance.

[Dakota]

We are instructed to not wear a watch on the field. I can't imagine there being an exception for wearing it on my mask instead of my wrist...

We have one park here that has scoreboards with game timers. When I've umpired on those fields, we inform the scorekeeper when to start the timer, and after that, it is up there for all to see. It works well, and has not been a problem. Sure, it MAY from time to time have an extra inning played over what would happen with a shaved timer in the pocket. Big deal. If the game is going to have an official timer, what is the problem with making it visible for all to see? Seems to work for any other timed sport.

I don't understand the objection to a timer on the backstop. Although I've never done that, it does not seem to be a big appearance issue (it's on the fence fer cryin' out loud - along with bat bags, helmet bags, lineup boards, and water bottles...) The Seattle approach to this seem highly anal, to me.

As to the math... if you want to really be precise, you need to include in your calulations the curvature of the ball and the thickness of the timer to determine how close the ball can be to the timer before it actually hits it. Talking about anal....

[bkbjones]

Yes, I have three kitchen timers I have confiscated off fences.

This was a decision made several years ago by our then Seattle Tacoma UIC and is still our steadfast policy.

Part of the reason is that we are in control of the game. As SRW pointed out, our coaches know that game time starts with the first pitch (unless the home team REALLY dawdles, in which case we simply loudly announce that the clock has started, which usually gets them racing out onto the field). If we have someone in an invitational who is not from our area, we kindly explain to them time starts with the opening pitch and please do not dawdle. We expect the home team to take the field ASAP after the plate meeting.

We usually do not shave time from games, but not saying that hasn't been done. Heck, as often as not a coach who is getting his/her butt handed to them will say something to the effect of "Hey Blue, aren't we done?" in which case we will usually agree with them. With a timer on the fence, you eliminate that option. Often, coaches do want to play the complete game or at least until time expires, but sometimes they do realize enough is enough. However, we are expected to NOT shave time from a game on our own.

We have not encountered a problem with coaches keeping UNOFFICIAL time. About 89% of the folks up here have cell phones, and last I checked they all indicated the time. When we have the official timepiece in a pocket or otherwise on our person, we have more complete control of the game. Plus, IMHO, there is nothing more annoying than that timer beeping back there on the fence -- usually starting about mid-pitch and throwing everything off kilter. Umpire has to call time, go back and stop the beeping, yada yada.

If it is your chapter's/TD/UIC opinion that you have a timer on the fence, then by all means use a timer on the fence. Just don't bring one to Seattle Tacoma, k? Otherwise, it clutters up my trunk and have to find that damned beeping timer when I throw something in there and it hits a button.

[Skahtboi]

Originally Posted by Dakota

We are instructed to not wear a watch on the field. I can't imagine there being an exception for wearing it on my mask instead of my wrist...

No one ever sees it. I have had partners ask me if I have something to keep time with all the time. I will raise my mask so they can see it, and they will look at me puzzled. I will indicate or say something about the right temple guard, and they will go "okay."

Everything is black. The watch, the facemask, the strap that ties it on.

[Skahtboi]

Originally Posted by Dakota

We are instructed to not wear a watch on the field. I can't imagine there being an exception for wearing it on my mask instead of my wrist...

We have one park here that has scoreboards with game timers. When I've umpired on those fields, we inform the scorekeeper when to start the timer, and after that, it is up there for all to see. It works well, and has not been a problem. Sure, it MAY from time to time have an extra inning played over what would happen with a shaved timer in the pocket. Big deal. If the game is going to have an official timer, what is the problem with making it visible for all to see? Seems to work for any other timed sport.

I don't understand the objection to a timer on the backstop. Although I've never done that, it does not seem to be a big appearance issue (it's on the fence fer cryin' out loud - along with bat bags, helmet bags, lineup boards, and water bottles...) The Seattle approach to this seem highly anal, to me.

As to the math... if you want to really be precise, you need to include in your calulations the curvature of the ball and the thickness of the timer to determine how close the ball can be to the timer before it actually hits it. Talking about anal....

Even on fields equipped like that, I still like to keep time. At least three times in the past I have started my watch with the scorekeeper, only to find that after the first inning I am two or so many ahead of the "official" time. I will walk back there and find out if they have turned the clock off, only to get the reply, to the effect that, "yes, I have turned it off every half inning." D'oh. I will give them quick instruction and play from there.

[Dakota]

Originally Posted by Skahtboi

Even on fields equipped like that, I still like to keep time.

I also keep the time on those fields. There have been issues (power failure, scoreboard glitch, etc.).

Even on other fields, I use a countdown timer that I keep in my extra ball bag (I've started wearing two) AND keep a watch with a countdown timer as a backup in my pocket. I have had my main countdown timer hit by foul balls. Usually, it causes no damage. I has stopped the timer once, and it has shattered the timer once. So, I keep a backup.

[bkbjones]

Originally Posted by Dakota

The Seattle approach to this seem highly anal, to me...

I'm so anal that in cold weather, all four cheeks get cold. Yes, we are anal. That's one reason why WA State is the home of the Bat Testing Lab.

We welcome all ASA umpires. Just leave that kitchen timer in the kitchen when you come visit.

[wadeintothem]

Originally Posted by SRW

I can guaran-frickin-tee you that if any of you come work games in Seattle, you'd better leave your kitchen timers in the kitchen, and not have them clipped to the backstop. If we've got a time limit (and we typically do), we tell the coaches that they can start their own clock with the first pitch, but our watch is official. Tell the coaches about an inning before time's about to expire that "this'll probably be the last inning" and there's no problem.

I've got two timers that I've removed from the back side of fences from umpires in tournaments I've UIC'd. (and I'm pretty sure bkbjones has some too for the same thing). If any of you need a new one, let me know, I'll send one to you. Just don't bring it back.

Ive seen some areas use em and some areas they dont... no big deal. Thats the policy of your area. I'm not sure who these people are that allow you to "confiscate" their stuff, or who you think you are to take peoples stuff, but that is weak of them. Must be a WA thing.