Foul tip

[Dakota]

Originally Posted by IRISHMAFIA

Which answers are correct?


1. B1 swings and contacts the ball that goes directly to F2’s glove.

a. That is a foul tip when caught if the ball never rises on its way from the bat to the catcher’s glove.
b. That is a foul tip when caught unless the ball rises above the batter’s head.
c. The ball is live if legally caught by F2.
d. The ball is dead on a foul tip.
e. Any fielder can legally catch a foul tip.

Edited: for the purpose of this post, assume directly infers "sharply"

Speaking ASA, a. would be correct, but contains contradictory information - it is a foul tip when caught (period), but since it has been stated the ball went directly to the glove, the ball did not rise.
b. same as for a, although I suppose it is possible the catcher's glove is also above the batter's head.
c. Correct for fastpitch and slowpitch with stealing. Not correct for slowpitch without stealing.
d. Inverse of c.
e. Not correct; must be caught by the catcher to be a foul tip.

Does the extra information (that is not possible for a and irrelevant for b) mean that those answers are "not correct" or that the extra information should be ignored? Also, without stating which division the question applies to, it is not possible to decide whether c or d is correct.

JMO, but if this was a test question, it is poorly worded. The only answer that is absolutely INcorrect is e.

[IRISHMAFIA]

Originally Posted by Dakota

JMO, but if this was a test question, it is poorly worded. The only answer that is absolutely INcorrect is e.

Now THAT is an incorrect statement.

[Dakota]

Originally Posted by IRISHMAFIA

Now THAT is an incorrect statement.

I assume after a suitable amout of time for everyone to answer (who is going to answer), you'll elighten me as to which other answer is absolutely incorrect.

a) is correct, but contradicts the stated situation
b) is correct if the catcher's glove is also above the batter's head
c) is correct for fastpitch & slowpitch with stealing
d) is correct for slowpitch without stealing
e) is incorrect

[rwest]

A ball that goes directly from the bat to the catchers glove/hand and is legally caught by the catcher is a foul tip. Nothing else has to be considered. Not the direction, not the height of the glove in relation to the ball. That's why A and B are incorrect. A ball that goes from the bat directly to the hand/glove can do so in a rising trajectory and still be a foul tip if the catcher's glove is above the ball when it makes contact with the bat.

C is correct if we are talking FP and SP with stealing. Otherwise it is incorrect.

D is correct if we are talking SP without stealing. Incorrect if we are talking FP or SP with stealing.

E is incorrect in all rulesets that I'm aware of.

[Dakota]

Originally Posted by rwest

...Nothing else has to be considered. Not the direction, not the height of the glove in relation to the ball. That's why A and B are incorrect. ....

No, that's why a and b contain superflouous information. The question does not ask "Which give information, all of which you must consider, on a foul tip." If says "Which answers are correct."

A car is speeding if it is exceeding the speed limit and it is red.

Is that a correct statement?

As I said above, this is a classic umpire exam poorly written question. You have to guess what the question really is asking, instead of simply what it did ask.

[rwest]

Originally Posted by Dakota

No, that's why a and b contain superflouous information. The question does not ask "Which give information, all of which you must consider, on a foul tip." If says "Which answers are correct."

A car is speeding if it is exceeding the speed limit and it is red.

Is that a correct statement?

As I said above, this is a classic umpire exam poorly written question. You have to guess what the question really is asking, instead of simply what it did ask.

No, that's not a correct statement. Your statement indicates that speeding requires going over the speed limit AND that the car be red. AND means both must be true for the statement to be true. Simple boolean algebra.

Now the statement's that Irish offered were incorrect because they placed conditions that are not part of the definition of a foul tip.

Consider this answer from Irish's original list....

That is a foul tip when caught if the ball never rises on its way from the bat to the catcher’s glove.

If this is a true statement then it will always be true. What if the ball does rise on its way to the catcher's glove? Is it still a foul tip? Yes. Therefore, A is incorrect.

[Dakota]

If you expect umpire exams to follow logic, you'll never score 100%. Too may of the questions require you to get inside the test-writer's head and try to guess (yes, guess) which answer would be "counted" wrong (as opposed to actually BEING wrong).

My "speeding" statement is correct as written. It does not say "must be red" only that the speeding car is red. It is still a speeding car, even though it is red. Red cars have no exemption from the speed laws.