A BOO from the ASA Adv. FP Camp

[SRW]

A good one for discussion. Seemed easy to me, but not to others.

Speaking ASA:
B1 is supposed to bat, but B2 bats and gets a single. B1 then comes to bat and takes strike 1. DEF appeals BOO.

What next? Any outs, who bats, what count, etc.?

[MNBlue]

Put B3 in the box with a 0-1 count, no additional outs.

[bellnier]

If I get this wrong feel free to make fun of old coach...

Let's see...

...if the BOO is corrected while wrong batter is still at bat, rule is designed such that offensive team will correct their mistake w/o penalty...

...if error is caught after this batter finishes at bat, but before next batter takes a legal pitch, rule is designed to punish offensive team (tsk, tsk) and reward defense...

...if mistake is caught after original BOO, AND after a legal pitch is delivered to next batter, then rule is designed to neither reward nor punsih either team...this is the OP...so my answer is that nothing happens, game continues as is.

[NCASAUmp]

Once the defense delivers a pitch (legal or illegal) to B1 (after B2 has already batted), B1 has simply missed their turn, and the defense missed their chance for appealing a BOO. It is then assumed that B2 batted legally. The next batter should be B3. B1 is now the one BOO. B3 simply assumes the one strike count. No outs.

[debeau]

Important to know who defense is appealing for batting out of order

[NCASAUmp]

Originally Posted by bellnier

If I get this wrong feel free to make fun of old coach...

Let's see...

...if the BOO is corrected while wrong batter is still at bat, rule is designed such that offensive team will correct their mistake w/o penalty...

...if error is caught after this batter finishes at bat, but before next batter takes a legal pitch, rule is designed to punish offensive team (tsk, tsk) and reward defense...

...if mistake is caught after original BOO, AND after a legal pitch is delivered to next batter, then rule is designed to neither reward nor punsih either team...this is the OP...so my answer is that nothing happens, game continues as is.

Well, you're close. The game continues as is... with B3 replacing B1 at bat with a 0-1 count. I'm assuming that's what you meant.

[NCASAUmp]

Originally Posted by debeau

Important to know who defense is appealing for batting out of order

Well, since only one batter can be at bat at a time, I'd say they're appealing the batter standing at the plate. At that point, that's the one you handle.

[debeau]

One cannot assume that that is who they are appealing , you have to know who or what the team is appealing .
Not being smart here . It IS important

[NCASAUmp]

Originally Posted by debeau

One cannot assume that that is who they are appealing , you have to know who or what the team is appealing .
Not being smart here . It IS important

As it pertains to the OP, they can only appeal B1 batting for B3. Since B1 had already received a pitch, B2 batted legally. The defense lost their appeal on B2 batting for B1 once they delivered the pitch. B1 is the one standing at the plate, and that's the only one you concern yourself with.

However, my statement in that post is incorrect when speaking about BOO in general. I realized it as soon as I was 100' from my desk. I was thinking specifically about the OP, which is why I'd phrased it the way I did. If the defense appealed it before a pitch was delivered, then that's different subsection.

[jimpiano]

Originally Posted by NCASAUmp

Well, since only one batter can be at bat at a time, I'd say they're appealing the batter standing at the plate. At that point, that's the one you handle.

The appeal is not specific in the OP.

If the defenses is appealing B2 in batting out of order the appeal would be denied.

The defense could then appeal B1.

[NCASAUmp]

Originally Posted by jimpiano

The appeal is not specific in the OP.

If the defenses is appealing B2 in batting out of order the appeal would be denied.

The defense could then appeal B1.

Considering most coaches will only scratch their heads and say, "I think they batted out of order, blue," that's good enough for me. BOO tends to get confusing, and I'm not going to trip them up and say, "well, if you only appealed B2 BOO, you're out of luck, guess again."

[debeau]

Thats fine NCASA Blue if you want to do it that way .
But appeals have to be specific .
Coach " the runner missed the base " Your way of thinking you would give an out .
In this scenario B2 was the first to bat out of order and more than likely that is what a coach would concentrate on .
Again , not being picky but any appeal must be specific , you have to know exactly what who when where why .

[NCASAUmp]

Originally Posted by debeau

Thats fine NCASA Blue if you want to do it that way .
But appeals have to be specific .
Coach " the runner missed the base " Your way of thinking you would give an out .
In this scenario B2 was the first to bat out of order and more than likely that is what a coach would concentrate on .
Again , not being picky but any appeal must be specific , you have to know exactly what who when where why .

You're over-extending what I admit to be a bit of my generosity with regards to this appeal. Keep it with the OP.

I won't give away exactly what happened to the coach ("why, yes, they did bat out of order. Oh, you're appealing the wrong one. You need to appeal the other one."), but I will allow the coach to go through the motions of making the appeal (showing me the batting order, who was missed). Eventually, the coach will get it right.

Most of the time, the coach only knows that they batted out of order. It is, in my opinion, allowable to say, "coach, once the defense pitches to the next batter, B2's at bat is legal." His next question is inevitably going to be, "well, who would that be?" My response: "the batter that follows B2 in the line-up." At that point, the lightbulb should go off in the coach's head that B1 is now batting in B3's spot.

That's all the leading I will give him, and that's all the leading I'm referring to. Beyond that, words are being typed into my keyboard for me.

Edited to correct some of my statements in this post.

[mcrowder]

Originally Posted by NCASAUmp

Considering most coaches will only scratch their heads and say, "I think they batted out of order, blue,"

"Who batted out of order, coach?"

Debeau is right - are they appealing that B2 batted out of order? If so, denied, let's play. Note that they have not yet lost their chance to appeal B1 batting out of order if the offense doesn't fix it.

If they are appealing B1, then putting B3 in the box is the answer.

I will partially agree with you though. If coach mentions both batters when he's coming in, deny the appeal on B2 (and explain if necessary) batting out of order and enforce the other one.

[IRISHMAFIA]

Originally Posted by SRW

A good one for discussion. Seemed easy to me, but not to others.

Speaking ASA:
B1 is supposed to bat, but B2 bats and gets a single. B1 then comes to bat and takes strike 1. DEF appeals BOO.

What next? Any outs, who bats, what count, etc.?

You're right, it was easy. And then people started to try and outhink the play.