Situation : Interference ?

[debeau]

Yep good theory question and I just had it at an ISF accreditation as my case play .
My answer was no interference play on could even have OBST.
Merle Butler who took the clinic said I was wrong .
Everyone at the clinic said I was wrong .
So as didnt want to embarrass Merle I asked him on his own.
Answer : Dead ball get the runner to return to 3rd and the batter to bat again .
I then asked the other examiner .
Wait until ball rolls fair then kill it and and have an out for Int
Then another examiner .
Dead ball runner out batter to 1st .
Other answers wer
Dead ball runner out batter bats on .
ISF mirrors ASA in the INTF rule but I really would like to know what to do the answer

[debeau]

A fair ball is also specific
A legally batted ball that settles on fair territory between home and first and home and third .
This ball at the crash was not fair as it was still moving and was not foul for the same reason .
If you do judge this as INTF then thats when you kill the ball so then it becomes foul and therefore no INTF .

[wadeintothem]

Originally Posted by debeau

Yep good theory question and I just had it at an ISF accreditation as my case play .
My answer was no interference play on could even have OBST.
Merle Butler who took the clinic said I was wrong .
Everyone at the clinic said I was wrong .
So as didnt want to embarrass Merle I asked him on his own.
Answer : Dead ball get the runner to return to 3rd and the batter to bat again .
I then asked the other examiner .
Wait until ball rolls fair then kill it and and have an out for Int
Then another examiner .
Dead ball runner out batter to 1st .
Other answers wer
Dead ball runner out batter bats on .
ISF mirrors ASA in the INTF rule but I really would like to know what to do the answer

Yep youre in a tough spot lol. Little bit more important for you to get it right.

I think the answer lies in the squeeze play which will illustrate why the intent of this rule would necessitate INT.

Slow spinning bunt 4 ft up the line on foul side but with the obvious motion that its going fair.. it's moving to fair territor quickly as a matter of fact.

Hard charging R1 from 3B -- F2 is reaching down to touch the ball foul.. runner runs through the catcher knocking the catcher over who misses touching the ball. The ball settles fair as it was obviously going to.

Nothing blatant for USC.. the decision is

Score the run or INT.


Those that score the run dont understand the intent of INT nor acknowledge that making a play on a otherwise fair ball to make it foul is a legit defensive play worthy of the protections of the intent of the rule.


To answer your other post.. a ball that settles fair before 3B is fair.

So a ball on the foul side that settles fair is fair.

And defensive players making a play on that ball are entitled to the protections of INT.

[argodad]

Excellent discussion! Thanks debeau. Even the experts disagree. Again we see the value of this board. So now I know what I'm going to do if it happens to me. I'm going to kill it and call it foul at the point of collision.

As Mike said, I'm probably going to have to explain my decision to a coach. Offense shouldn't have to much to gripe about. (The other option was interference and an out.) If the defense comes out to talk: "Coach, you can't have interference on the runner on a foul ball."
"But Blue, it rolled fair!"
"It was foul when I killed the play, Coach. Let's play."

[wadeintothem]

Originally Posted by argodad

Excellent discussion! Thanks debeau. Even the experts disagree. Again we see the value of this board. So now I know what I'm going to do if it happens to me. I'm going to kill it and call it foul at the point of collision.

As Mike said, I'm probably going to have to explain my decision to a coach. Offense shouldn't have to much to gripe about. (The other option was interference and an out.) If the defense comes out to talk: "Coach, you can't have interference on the runner on a foul ball."
"But Blue, it rolled fair!"
"It was foul when I killed the play, Coach. Let's play."

What rule is being used to kill the ball?

If its INT ... well then enforce the INT. I'm not sure how you are interpretting the rules to only enforce half of INT (just DB)

This is a do over... maybe easiest and the path of least resistance through coaches - but strictly by the book, I dont see how you (and Dakota) are doing it.

[mcrowder]

My take:

We have a ball with no current fair/foul status over foul territory.

We have a fielder interfered with. Dead ball!

At the moment of the dead ball, the ball is over foul territory, so we now have a FOUL ball.

By rule, there is no out for interference with a fielder fielding a grounded foul ball. So - no out. Just a foul ball.

In other words, while you have interference, you do not have a rules basis for an out. Logically, the only thing left is a foul ball.

[wadeintothem]

Originally Posted by mcrowder

My take:

We have a ball with no current fair/foul status over foul territory.

We have a fielder interfered with. Dead ball!

At the moment of the dead ball, the ball is over foul territory, so we now have a FOUL ball.

By rule, there is no out for interference with a fielder fielding a grounded foul ball. So - no out. Just a foul ball.

In other words, while you have interference, you do not have a rules basis for an out. Logically, the only thing left is a foul ball.

There is no rule-book basis for an INT call on a ball that is not fair. INT is very specific

[tcblue13]

That is the net result. No Int call

If you let the situation play out like a DDB sitch (I see this as the only other option)
Kill it whe F5 touches the ball and declare R1 out and put BR on first base. The O coach will go ballistic "Why the h*ck didn't you call it when it happened?"
"Well coach, it's technically not Int when the ball is foul, however the ball rolled fair so then it became interference so I had to call it then."

Now another question
Can a player "make a play" on or "attempt to field" a foul ball or a ball in foul territory?
Certainly yes if the ball does not touch the ground, but a slow roller that has not been ruled foul or dead is a different story isn't it?

Ergo, what do you do with the crash?
F5 has to be able to make a play on the ball, right?

[tcblue13]

Coach, The ball is dead on the interference on F5 by B1
The ball became dead in foul territory.
The foul ball nullifies the interference since interference can only be called on a fair batted ball.
Consequently all runners are returned to the bases occupied at the time of the pitch.
A strike is charged to the batter (if there are not already 2 strikes.)
Play on

[Dakota]

Originally Posted by debeau

Yep good theory question and I just had it at an ISF accreditation as my case play .
My answer was no interference play on could even have OBST.
Merle Butler who took the clinic said I was wrong .
Everyone at the clinic said I was wrong .
So as didnt want to embarrass Merle I asked him on his own.
Answer : Dead ball get the runner to return to 3rd and the batter to bat again .
I then asked the other examiner .
Wait until ball rolls fair then kill it and and have an out for Int
Then another examiner .
Dead ball runner out batter to 1st .
Other answers wer
Dead ball runner out batter bats on .
ISF mirrors ASA in the INTF rule but I really would like to know what to do the answer

I am amazed that a question such as this would be on an accreditation test without an agreed official interpretation among the examiners.

That said, I have several comments on points raised in this thread.

Speaking ASA.

First, I agree with WMB - there is no good reason to have the rule written differently for a R vs a BR.

Second, I disagree with the theory that all batted balls are fair until they become foul. If that were the case, Rule 1 could simply say "FAIR BALL - Any batted ball that has not been declared a FOUL ball."

Third, my comment just above is at least called into question by the wording of ASA rule 8-8-E, which uses the curious phrase "fair untouched batted ball over foul territory" - now, that could mean a batted ball that contacted a base (definition FAIR BALL - E) and was deflected by the base into foul territory. Otherwise, I don't see how any untouched batted ball could be fair and also over foul territory where a runner could contact it.

Fourth, I'm with argodad on the call.