Rule on this one.

[greymule]

I was in Pennsylvania yesterday umpiring a 16u "showcase" from 7:45 a.m. to 8:10 p.m. There were zillions of teams (and illegal bats) from all over the country. I personally had teams from, besides the home state, Virginia, Connecticut, Rhode Island, New Jersey, Illinois, and Colorado. Seven game slots, and I did six, since the third guy in our crew had to leave early and officiate a women's professional football game in Philadelphia.

So I didn't check the board until now.

I don't see any difference in effect between a third out appeal for missing 1B and (as in the case book play with the changed ruling) a third out for failing to reach 1B, however belated such a third out might be. But it's the concept of fourth out on the BR at 1B that troubles me. If the guy who crashes is called out and does not score, then the miss of 1B, even if appealed, is irrelevant, since a fourth out nullifies a run only on a runner who has scored. But to avoid invoking 10-1-L, let's just say the BR is tagged out at home. Three outs, and the appeal at 1B does not nullify any runs. F2 would have to know not to tag the BR but instead to make sure the appeal at 1B was the third, not the fourth, out. (I can hear F2 after he finds out that the fourth out at 1B nullifies no runs: "Open your eyes, Blue! I missed him by a mile at the plate. He scored easy! And didn't you see me drop the ball?") The BR would be smart not to score, but to get himself declared the third out in some way that 10-1-L could not reverse.

I must say I'm puzzled at the ASA rule change of 2003. They were in line with every other code, so why change anything? Why not allow a fourth out 1B, either an appeal for a miss or a simple out for failure to reach to reach 1B, solely because that runner did not score?

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Another example BR reaches 1st, steps of the base towards home, ball is thrown to F3 who steps on the base. force is re-instated and BR is out.

I don't know that ASA has ever ruled on that play, but the "force" at 1B is not reinstated in other codes. In OBR, for instance, that runner must be tagged.

[IRISHMAFIA]

Originally Posted by greymule

Another example BR reaches 1st, steps of the base towards home, ball is thrown to F3 who steps on the base. force is re-instated and BR is out.

I don't know that ASA has ever ruled on that play, but the "force" at 1B is not reinstated in other codes. In OBR, for instance, that runner must be tagged.

ASA addressed this in April's clarifications:

http://www.asasoftball.com/umpires/c...s_2006_apr.asp

[greymule]

RE: reinstated force at 1B

Thanks for the link to that clarification. I can now rest easier, as for many years I had lost sleep for having called a BR out on the following play:

BR hit a weak fly ball to short RF and ran to 1B (bat in hand). When he saw F10 about to make the catch, he turned and trotted back down the 1B line. Of course, F10 dropped the ball, but he picked it up and threw to 1B before BR could get back to the bag. I called the BR out based on the concept of reinstated "force." However, in a later discussion of how to handle this play in OBR, I learned that because the BR had not actually "occupied" a preceding base, it was technically not a force play. Applying the same reasoning to softball, I figured that since a force can't be reinstated if it wasn't a force in the first place, I had blown the call. Luckily, the team I thought I had robbed lost by a large margin, so I haven't lived with an actual game outcome on my conscience ever since.

However, I'm now glad to know I was right.

Just don't tell me now that ASA's rule was different 25 years ago.