2 umpire mechanics

[Dakota]

NFHS varsity contest. Two very good teams.

R1 on 2B. Batter hits a hard infield grounder. F6 fields it. R1 running toward 3rd. F6 decides to throw to attempt to get R1 instead of taking BR at 1st. R1 does not slide, runs to the outfield side of F5, who takes the throw and attempts a swipe tag about 1-2 feet from the bag. BU has moved with the play toward 3B; is about 10-12' from 3B on the outfield side at the time of the play. Actual tag is hidden from BU by R1. BU calls safe. DC wants to discuss call. BU conferences with PU. PU says he did not see it, he was watching BR to first.

Please critique the mechanics of both.

[CecilOne]

Ignoring the possibility that R1 was >3' off base line avoiding tag.
1) PU needs caffeine.
2) One specific missing - was F6 inside or outside the base line when fielding/throwing.
3) Looks like the BU was outside the base line if blocked by R1 who was outfield side of F5 - ok if F6 was inside, or if too quick to be elsewhere.

Obviously, BU would be better off closer to 3rd to get a better angle, might have been too deep if swipe tag was inside R1 and outside base line.

4) BU would have been inside if moving past F6 to see play at 1st; then turning to follow the ball. Like to think I would be and certainly would have preferred, but w/o knowing more about F6 depth, number of outs, hard to say.

Is that a start?

[Chess Ref]

CecilOne- it seems you said that you would get inside of F6 . Wow-I have been waiting behind the infielder and then busting butt to make the call. In my little ole pea brain it just seems that I don't want to get in front of F6,in this case, or risk becoming part of the play. i am definetly open to being admonished and corrected on this ine of thinking I have.....

[CecilOne]

Originally Posted by Chess Ref

CecilOne- it seems you said that you would get inside of F6 . Wow-I have been waiting behind the infielder and then busting butt to make the call. In my little ole pea brain it just seems that I don't want to get in front of F6,in this case, or risk becoming part of the play. i am definetly open to being admonished and corrected on this ine of thinking I have.....

I am not going to admonish or correct for followingthe norm. I will correct that I did not say in front of F6, not anywhere that might interfere with play or not see what the fielder would do. I meant going to the side of the play, moving toward 1st, especially with 2 outs. Also, I position closer to 2nd in C than most, again especially with 2 outs. Yes, we must wait behond the fielder in B or C, to be sure of not being in the way, until the path and distance of the batted ball is obvious.

[Dakota]

Additional info.

No outs.
F6 fielded the ball and made the throw inside the baselines - in the infield.

Very good teams, play developed very fast.

BU was outside the baseline, and R1 remained upright between BU and F5, who came off the base a couple of steps for the throw and tag attempt.

IMO, BU should have been closer to 3B, but the play was too fast to get there. May have been positioned too far away to being with. BU was not moving with R1, but expected a play at 1B.

I was BU - critique - I can take it. I was astonished at my partner's answer, though. Any comments there? (We had not worked together before.)

[MNBlue]

Tom,

With a runner on second, I am about 15-20' towards third, and at least 5 feet behind F6. I'm sure I would have been anticipating a play at first as well and as F6 fielded the ball, I would have stepped in towards first, hopefully keeping an eye on the ball.

With my partner understanding (pre-game) that he would have the call at third on a throw from F3 to F5 if R1 is approaching third (PU would have the 90 degree angle) and I would have the call at third if R1 has rounded third and is returning, I would expect my partner to make the call at third, even though it was the first play. I would have a look from behind R1 should my partner need help.

In your situation, I'm guessing that I would be on the baseline looking at the play from behind, and when I realized that the throw went to third, I would attempt to back up and get a better look at what is happening behind the base, expecting my partner to be able to help on 'stuff' that happens in front of the base.

I'm certain your post game included keeping your eye on the ball.

[CecilOne]

Originally Posted by Dakota

F6 fielded the ball and made the throw inside the baselines - in the infield.Very good teams, play developed very fast.

Means F6 charged the ball? If so, right or rushing as Steve implied, I would have been moving toward 1st, parallel with F6, so probably would have been between F6 and 2nd base when she turned to throw. That might have given me an angle on the throw, if the swipe tag wasn't more than 30 degrees or so off the 2nd-3rd line.

Originally Posted by Dakota

BU was outside the baseline, and R1 remained upright between BU and F5, who came off the base a couple of steps for the throw and tag attempt.
IMO, BU should have been closer to 3B, but the play was too fast to get there. May have been positioned too far away to being with. BU was not moving with R1, but expected a play at 1B.

Sure closer to the play is always nice, but it looks like the angle would be bad, anyway.

Originally Posted by Dakota

I was BU - critique - I can take it.

Are you sure?