Game ending appeal play!

[Illini_Ref]

This is from illinoishighschoolsports.com Can anyone give a ruling here.

Bottom of the 7th...0 - 0 tie..two out..runner on 2nd.

Slow roller to short..short scoops and throws to first...the base umpire calls the runner out. The team leaves the field, as the team is leaving the field, the runner crosses the plate.

The Home team appeals to the home plate umpire to rule if the 1st baseman pulled her foot. The Home Plate umpire, overturns the out call and allows the run to score. Game over.
I say the runner should have to go back to 3rd. Anyone disagree?

[AtlUmpSteve]

Originally Posted by Illini_Ref

This is from illinoishighschoolsports.com Can anyone give a ruling here.

Bottom of the 7th...0 - 0 tie..two out..runner on 2nd.

Slow roller to short..short scoops and throws to first...the base umpire calls the runner out. The team leaves the field, as the team is leaving the field, the runner crosses the plate.

The Home team appeals to the home plate umpire to rule if the 1st baseman pulled her foot. The Home Plate umpire, overturns the out call and allows the run to score. Game over.
I say the runner should have to go back to 3rd. Anyone disagree?

As you described it, it is likely that the runner should be returned to 3rd; the defense was put in jeopardy by the change of the call. But, several years ago, I once had to rule the other way in an NCAA D1 game; boy, did I hear it.

R1 on 2nd was that team's leadoff slap hitter, fast as the wind; had stolen 2nd and was safe by plenty. Takes off on the pitch, stealing 3rd, when batter hits the ball deep in shortstop hole. Base umpire started on the outfield grass cut, and stays behind the shortstop and calls the out at first from 90' away, at least. Meanwhile, R1 never stopped, and was 3-4 steps from home when the first baseman turned with the ball. When she hears the out call, she sprints into the dugout, and her team follows (to try to get off the field before the call is changed, I believe).

Meantime, the female first base coach is jumping up and down and pointing at the bag, saying she was off the bag, but her domineering male haed coach on third doesn't allow her to talk to umpires. Base ump decides he didn't hear the words "ask for help", so he doesn't, and is sweeping the pitching plate when third base coach finally gets the message, and asks him to check with me for the pulled foot. Hell, yeah, she was off completely, almost 6" off; he asks if we should call them back on the field, hell yeah, we can't refuse to change the call because the defense ran off the field and he refused to ask until then.

So, the defensive head coach goes nuts when we change the call, and put her team back on the field. According to her, we can't do that once the defense leaves the field, because it is an appeal. I point out that this isn't an appeal, whose definition starts with a "request by the defense", and how would the rulesmakers allow the defense to run off the field to avoid the question; no, the defense loses it's right to appeal of IT runs off the field. Finally get her calmed down and keep her in the game; she goes back to the dugout, then realizes I haven't put the runner back, and comes back out. Her new argument is that it is a dead ball once the third out is called, and that I should put the runner back. I requote the rule which requires me to make a judgment and correct either team if put in jeopardy by cahnging the call; I saw a runner who would have scored absolutely, without even a throw if the right call had been made immediately. I also point out that her first baseman surely knew she was off (since was off by that much), and if she thought she had a play, probably would have (and should have) made a play.

Hard work to keep the coach in that game. I managed, but found my car keyed in the parking lot after the game, and I was redlined from that school for the next 3 years (as long as that coach lasted). While I haven't refused, I haven't been assigned to work with that base umpire since.

To make matters worse, my college assignor told the coach I was wrong, and even claimed to get a ruling from the NCAA saying I was wrong. Since his question to the NCAA didn't include my game report, and asked if I should honor an "appeal" once the defense left the field, I knew what use he was. I gave a copy to a coach on the NCAA rules committee at that time (whose team I umpired for later that year; after, he had told her I honored an "appeal" after the inning; funny how he never missed a chance to sell out anyone not in his preferred clique); she, at least, took the time to read it, and agreed with me. Not surprisingly, when she then told my assignor she agreed with me, he was upset that I stepped out of his chain of command to get a ruling. Good news was, he was replaced as assignor later, too.

[CecilOne]

We often joke about "getting the big bucks"; but of any call deserved premium pay it was that one.

[Steve M]

Steve,
I'm intereted in how you kept that coach in that game - I understand about the politics of the coach and the assignor.
Thanks

[AtlUmpSteve]

I approached it with the knowledge that we (the umpire team) had screwed it up, and that she had every right to be unhappy with our performance. Add on that she had every reason to be disappointed with the results, so I had to accept a fair ration of crap. And the cause, the base umpire, stayed as far away as he could. Good thing, too; I may have offered him up as a live sacrifice for her.

So, I just kept my cool, answered her objections, pointed out that I knew that "we" had not handled the situation the way "we" should have, and told her that I was willing to let her take it out on me, within reason. I think that shocked her into understanding that I had no choice but to rule as I did, and she finally backed off, and we finished the game without further issue.