Let's talk strike zone and changes

[WestMichBlue]

”but with pitchers being able to use various angles I have called strikes on pitches that landed a good half a foot of the side of the plate because it crossed a portion of the plate.

It may look that way, but unless the pitcher was illegal (sidearm or stepping way out of the 24” limit), or throwing a ton of ball movement, it probably is not mathematically possible. If the pitcher releases the ball 4”-6” outside (your left) of the pitching plate, appx 34’ from home plate, and the ball just nicks the outside (right) of home plate, and F2 frames the catch – you will see the ball is an inch or less outside the edge of the plate.

However, the issue brought up by booker227, and not answered so far, is our strike zone being challenged more today than in the past. Booker said: ”For the first time in many seasons, I find my strike zone being challenged considerably more than in the past by high school and travel ball coaches and players. ……that for the first time I'm beginning to get defensive with coaches and players. Have any of my brethren suffered through this like I am, and how did, or do, you deal with it?”

I share that position with booker. Over the past two years I also have been subjected to strike zone criticism, especially with respect to the outside pitch. This is happening with high-level HS or Travel or college pitchers. They want the outside pitch – and I am not giving it!

Girls are getting bigger, and they are hitting the weight room, and are swinging 34” bats. They crowd the plate and coaches feel that they can hit a pitch that is 3” – 6” off the plate. And they want it called for their own pitchers.

I also have an oval strike zone; I have always given the pitchers 1” – 2” off the plate. But they want more, and I’ve had some real battles with stubborn pitchers. In a tournament semi-final 18U game last summer I had two college pitchers throwing 6” off the plate. For three innings I called balls, and the undercurrent in the dugouts was not pleasant. Eventually both pitchers brought the ball in and then we had four innings of hits and great fielding and a good ball game. But at the end of the game I had two coaches madder than wet hornets as I fled for the security of the official’s room.

Coaches don’t want the low pitch, and they sure don’t want the high pitches. But you better give them inside and outside by several inches or you’ll hear it. Booker227 asks “how do we deal with it?” I am really looking at this issue in preparation for the coming year. I am stubborn – and I don’t want to call a strike on a pitch 4” off the plate. But I am realistic enough to know that the game is constantly changing and I have to adapt. The next time I have high-level pitchers I am probably going to widen the plate. And probably drop the top and raise the bottom to compensate for the wider zone.

WMB

[IRISHMAFIA]

Originally posted by baldgriff
I would disagree that the whole ball hour glass or egg thing. Any part of the ball crossing any part of the plate in the strike zone is a strike.

Now I ump USSSA (so I get a bit of circus out there) but with pitchers being able to use various angles I have called strikes on pitches that landed a good half a foot of the side of the plate because it crossed a portion of the plate.

As clarification, I believe this is referring to SP, not FP strike zone.

[azbigdawg]

Originally posted by WestMichBlue
”but with pitchers being able to use various angles I have called strikes on pitches that landed a good half a foot of the side of the plate because it crossed a portion of the plate.

It may look that way, but unless the pitcher was illegal (sidearm or stepping way out of the 24” limit), or throwing a ton of ball movement, it probably is not mathematically possible. If the pitcher releases the ball 4”-6” outside (your left) of the pitching plate, appx 34’ from home plate, and the ball just nicks the outside (right) of home plate, and F2 frames the catch – you will see the ball is an inch or less outside the edge of the plate.

However, the issue brought up by booker227, and not answered so far, is our strike zone being challenged more today than in the past. Booker said: ”For the first time in many seasons, I find my strike zone being challenged considerably more than in the past by high school and travel ball coaches and players. ……that for the first time I'm beginning to get defensive with coaches and players. Have any of my brethren suffered through this like I am, and how did, or do, you deal with it?”

I share that position with booker. Over the past two years I also have been subjected to strike zone criticism, especially with respect to the outside pitch. This is happening with high-level HS or Travel or college pitchers. They want the outside pitch – and I am not giving it!

Girls are getting bigger, and they are hitting the weight room, and are swinging 34” bats. They crowd the plate and coaches feel that they can hit a pitch that is 3” – 6” off the plate. And they want it called for their own pitchers.

I also have an oval strike zone; I have always given the pitchers 1” – 2” off the plate. But they want more, and I’ve had some real battles with stubborn pitchers. In a tournament semi-final 18U game last summer I had two college pitchers throwing 6” off the plate. For three innings I called balls, and the undercurrent in the dugouts was not pleasant. Eventually both pitchers brought the ball in and then we had four innings of hits and great fielding and a good ball game. But at the end of the game I had two coaches madder than wet hornets as I fled for the security of the official’s room.

Coaches don’t want the low pitch, and they sure don’t want the high pitches. But you better give them inside and outside by several inches or you’ll hear it. Booker227 asks “how do we deal with it?” I am really looking at this issue in preparation for the coming year. I am stubborn – and I don’t want to call a strike on a pitch 4” off the plate. But I am realistic enough to know that the game is constantly changing and I have to adapt. The next time I have high-level pitchers I am probably going to widen the plate. And probably drop the top and raise the bottom to compensate for the wider zone.

WMB

As far as inside and outside...I give them about one ball width inside...and 1 1/2 ball widths outside..... I do NOT give the "coffin Corners" ESPECIALLY not inside or outside and low.... no complaints from coaches on either side. I also chop just a little off the top..... Now keep in mind..this zone is for higher level ball.... for rec ball or lower level club ball, I will expand it a little....

[scottk_61]

Originally posted by chuck chopper
(Imagine a side view)
I draw a line through the midle of the arm pit and the middle of the knee cap. The whole ball has to be between those two lines in order to be a strike [for veticle]
.
For Inside/Outside- As mentioned in young rec council level games I think almost baters box to batters box is a good width for the strike zone. For older/Better leagues or club ball I tend to want the whole ball over the plate for inside pitches & I give all the outside edge of the plate for outside pitches.

The requirement for the whole ball to be within your lines is faulty in my opinion and in the teaching of ASA as well as the desires of NCAA.
If any part of the ball passes through that zone (I like your description) I have a strike.

I think you limit yourself with the whole ball having to pass within that area, do you limit yourself to the whole ball having to pass over the plate or do you allow for part of it to hit the black?

Just some food for thouhgt

[Justme]

As a long time baseball umpire preparing to work my first HS softball games next season I find from the responses on this post that softball umpire strike zones differ just as much as baseball umpires.

Some of you say they draw a line through the middle of the arm pit and the middle of the knee cap.
Some say that coaches don't want the low pitch, and they sure don't want the high pitches.
Some think that in some levels batters box to batters box is a good width for the strike zone.
Some say that coaches want strikes called 3 - 6" off the plate.
Some of you use an oval strike zone, eliminating the "coffin Corners"
Some of you use the book referenced rectangle zone.

So if you were going to design the "perfect" strike zone for HS softball, assuming large schools with good programs, what would it be? Where would you, based on your experiences, advise an umpire that is new to softball to set his zone?

Thanks in advance

[Rachel]

I place my eyes at the level of just below the armpit. If I track the ball down with my eyes, follow it through the plate, it is low enough.

I will give about 1/2 a ball outside (that means a ball and 1/2 to some I guess).

Inside, for good high school and college they need to get at least a part of the ball on the black. If the ball breaks and hits the back or front of the plate as it crosses that is a strike. For lower level I will give an inch off the plate.

I judge the knees as if part of the ball hits the top of the knee it is high enough.

I will say again though give the inside and outside corner at the knee. The hitters should be able to either hit the pitch or fight it off if they are a good hitter. That's what makes them good hitters.

You do however need to see the pitches so getting into the slot and setting (before the release) is very important.

This is what has worked for me and I have developed over 15 years of calling softball. I will post a photo of what I mean by seeing from the slot on the frapper site.

[Mike Walsh]

Originally posted by Rachel

This is what has worked for me and I have developed over 15 years of calling softball. I will post a photo of what I mean by seeing from the slot on the frapper site.

Before I asked what the frapper site was I tried to figure it out on my own. The best I could do on Google was:

Slo-Pitch National Member's Only Forum - Bat - [ Translate this page ]est-ce qu'il y en a qui ont entendu parler du DA BOMB de Combat softball il ce ... Moi je vais frapper avec un bon vieux worth bleu. pis pour le pool,

Now, I'm not conversant in French, but I am curious. Does frapper have anything to do with combat softall? What kind of protective equipment do French umpires wear to protect against bombs? And I thought the French were a bunch of passive sissies! Piss poor the pool refers to coaches, right?

Mike

[Andy]

Originally posted by Mike Walsh

Before I asked what the frapper site was I tried to figure it out on my own. The best I could do on Google was:

Slo-Pitch National Member's Only Forum - Bat - [ Translate this page ]est-ce qu'il y en a qui ont entendu parler du DA BOMB de Combat softball il ce ... Moi je vais frapper avec un bon vieux worth bleu. pis pour le pool,

Now, I'm not conversant in French, but I am curious. Does frapper have anything to do with combat softall? What kind of protective equipment do French umpires wear to protect against bombs? And I thought the French were a bunch of passive sissies! Piss poor the pool refers to coaches, right?

Mike

Mike - go to this thread:

http://www.officialforum.com/thread/23230

[nubie]

Now you sound like a fair umpire to me, not like some who squeeze the strike zone to make their lives easier when umping, forcing the pitcher to throw it right down the middle, tough on pitcher who paint the corners or are finesse or junk pitchers!

Originally posted by mcrowder
I hate the fact that so many here have used the phrase "my strike zone". I don't own a strike zone. I call by a set of rules that tells me what the strikezone is (a rectangular prism, by the way), and call strikes and balls based on those rules.

Why do anything else?

[Andy]

Originally posted by nubie
...not like some who squeeze the strike zone to make their lives easier when umping, forcing the pitcher to throw it right down the middle...

This comment proves that you don't have a clue.

Squeezing the strike zone does not make an umpire's life easier, in fact, it has just the opposite effect. Games take much longer to complete, both benches and pitchers start complaining about the small zone, etc.

Any good umpire wants to call every legitimate strike they can get. It keeps the bats swinging and the game moving along, lots of action and enjoyable to watch and play.

(I know, I know...feeding the troll, but I couldn't resist.)

[bkbjones]

I learned something from my UIC and a few others that I take to heart:

EVERY pitch is a strike until it PROVES that it is a ball.

As for my specific zone, it's kind of an elongated stop sign, wider in the middle than at the top or bottom. I give nothing at the knees (I want the whole ball above the knee), and my eyes are set at the top of the zone.

[Panda Bear]

could your eyesight be changing? Specifically, depth perception.

At the risk of inviting blind umpire humor to a serious question, this could be a factor. As we age, eyesight changes, sometimes to the point that depth & distance judgement changes. It can be suttle & gradual, so that you don't notice it yourself, but maybe where you now see the bottom outside corner to be & where others have and continue to see it may not be the same place.