How much do you take

[officialtony]

Folks,
Just my opinion, but we sign on to do the job.
Sometimes it is easy and sometimes it is not.
But we do our job.
I am not a coach and I don't care what skill level the competitors are. I stand behind the plate and do my job. As was mentioned earlier, how hard can a 10, 11, 12 year old throw, that my equipment ( which I wear at the varsity level ) won't protect me? I'm going to stay there and do my job. If the catcher can sit back there and face her pitcher, can I do no less? I will let my equipment and my reflexes do the job and pray for only one of these type games a year.
Just my humble opinion.

[scottk_61]

I have watched this thread develp with some amusement and some dismay.
If the cathcers ability or inablity is the issue, you need to make some decisions.

If you cannot call YOUR game because the catcher is so poor, you should talk to the coach.

I don't think you should tell the coach to make changes BUT you can tell him he may not get too many strkes called if you can't see it.

NOW, let me qualify this by saying that I worked a Gold team that decided to try out a "new" catcher who quite frankly sucked.
The pitcher was hitting her mark perfectly but the catcher never got a glove on it.
After getting hit in the exact same place on five pitches in a row, I told the coach we needed a "real" catcher or the game was going to get real long.
The coach objected and so did I.

I had a serious bruise for over two months.
I mean getting hit in the exact same spot by a Gold level pitcher 5 times in a row, that hurts.

I stayed in the slot and took the hits But when the point came that I was twitching and jumping, I told the coach a change was needed.

I have been beat up by many younger kids and had a few bruises too but I never remember telling a coach he had to make a change.
I sure encouraged it though!

[SRW]

Originally posted by DNTXUM P
I worked a 10 and under B tournament this past weekend. The first pool game, the coach decided his pitcher needed to work on drop pitches. They all hit the groind in front of the plate. The catcher was sort of trying but she is 9 and could not block them. I was hit 18 times the first inning. Some of them where I had no protection. After gieeing hit with the first 3 pitches in the 2nd inning I asked the coach to quit calling drops and explained why. He talked to his catcher about trying to block the pitches. The coach continued to throw drops, the pitcher bounced them in front of the plate, the catcher still could not block them and I continued to get hit. I finally backed up to about 5 ft in front of the backstop to call pitches. The coach called time, told me I could not see the pitches from that location and I could not tell him what pitches he could call for his pitcher. I agreed with him o both counts. He told me I was getting paid, to do my job and I needed to move up. i told him I was getting paid to call balls and strikes, not be a backstop and I would be calling from this position when his kid pitched. I moved back up when the other team pitched. I don't mind getting hit occasionally and I know it is part of the game for 10 & unders, but I will not continually take a beating for something that should be worked on in practice. Fortunately, we had 55 min drop dead with 5 runs per half inning during pool play.

Dude, how hard can that hurt? She's 9. Get some shin guards and man up. Your strike zone should NOT change from one pitcher to the next, regardless of the fact that you're taking a beating.

[BuggBob]

I don't think I have purposely changed my strike Zone during a beating, but I have started to involuntarily flinch when a bean ball is coming my way. And flinching does change your zone.

[DNTXUM P]

Dude, how hard can that hurt? She's 9. Get some shin guards and man up. Your strike zone should NOT change from one pitcher to the next, regardless of the fact that you're taking a beating

Dude, she probably threw 45 mph, with no idea where her drop was going (except into the ground. The pitches that hit my shin guards, chest protector, mask and cup did not hurt. The ones that hit the back of my hands, fingers, and arms did hurt and it happened several times. I do not rely on my quick reactions to keep from getting hit. I do not move or flinch. If this coach wanted to mix in her drop as practice once in a while, I would stayed where I was, but he every pitch he called was a drop and none of them reached the plate. He was not concerned about throwing strikes. We played a five run max per inning and all 5 runs scored each inning were walked in. I did not have to worry about my strike zone changing. I could clearly see that the pitches did not reach the plate.

[CecilOne]

Who catches or pitches and how well they do it is none of our business. If you want to tell the coach that you can't maintain your strike zone (and your image) because you expect the next pitch to hit you, that's your prerogative.

The only catcher I asked to have removed was one in AA slow pitch whose odor was making me nauseous. Not even the Varsity catcher who called for high and inside and deliberately dropped her glove because she didn't like the call on the previous pitch.

[bkbjones]

I have put up with a lot of crud...like a fractured hand last summer because a coach wanted this girl to "try out." Couldn't do it during practice, of course...

But in a men's fastpitch game last year, I did tell the catcher to either use the glove or give it to me and I would use it, but I was not the backstop.

I wouldn't say that to anyone's DD, but this "gentleman" got the point real quick. Most catchers in men's are pretty good...but the regular catcher was at the hospital with his wife, and the other catcher was pitching...and they had literally drawn straws to see who would catch. After my little comment, which was strictly between me and him in a quiet but firm voice, he was fine.

A lot of times a quiet, firm, non-sarcastic comment can help out with a young catcher.

[SRW]

Originally posted by DNTXUM P
Dude, how hard can that hurt? She's 9. Get some shin guards and man up. Your strike zone should NOT change from one pitcher to the next, regardless of the fact that you're taking a beating

Dude, she probably threw 45 mph, with no idea where her drop was going (except into the ground. The pitches that hit my shin guards, chest protector, mask and cup did not hurt. The ones that hit the back of my hands, fingers, and arms did hurt and it happened several times. I do not rely on my quick reactions to keep from getting hit. I do not move or flinch. If this coach wanted to mix in her drop as practice once in a while, I would stayed where I was, but he every pitch he called was a drop and none of them reached the plate. He was not concerned about throwing strikes. We played a five run max per inning and all 5 runs scored each inning were walked in. I did not have to worry about my strike zone changing. I could clearly see that the pitches did not reach the plate.

I'm curious as to how you could see the strike zone being so far back. How could you see the plate, more especially the outside corner? Can you see if the catcher turned her wrist, or framed it? How can you judge the location of the ball in relation to the front of the plate?

By moving back to the backstop, your strike zone changed. Whether you admit it did or not, it changed. You had a different perspective of how the ball crossed the plate with one pitcher compared to the other.

So often on this board (and others) we talk about the vantage point of different umps, different positions, who saw what, etc. An example is the mechanics of the PU trailing the runner to 1B to see if F3 pulled her foot - all because it's more difficult for the BU to see that. If you had to move because you were afraid of getting hit, you altered your view... and yes, your strike zone changed.

How the coach calls pitches is his business. If he's willing to make every pitch a ball, then so be it. It's not our place at all as umpires to demand that a player be replaced solely on the fact that they are less adequate than another player. It's also not our job to change how we umpire based on the abilities of various players. Do the job as trained. Remain fair and partial to both sides, and have fun in the process.

[mcrowder]

Originally posted by CecilOne
Not even the Varsity catcher who called for high and inside and deliberately dropped her glove because she didn't like the call on the previous pitch.

I agree with the rest of your post... but if you knew this was intentional, I've seen this catcher dumped before.

[whiskers_ump]

Originally posted by mcrowder

I agree with the rest of your post... but if you knew this was intentional, I've seen this catcher dumped before.

Have seen this twice in National tournament. Both catcher and coach were dumped each time.
One time they allowed the pitcher to remain, but in the other incident, they dumped all
three.

[CecilOne]

Thanks, but couldn't prove it. Luckily, it hit my chest guard, so I didn't have to react.

[Big Kahuna]

CecilOne,

How long did your Varsity catcher stay in the game after she dropped her glove?

[JEL]

Originally posted by CecilOne
Thanks, but couldn't prove it. Luckily, it hit my chest guard, so I didn't have to react.

Shouldn't have to "prove" that one, your judgement would suffice IMO.

I agree with trying to be professional and doing the job you are being paid for, but I think you take as much as you can take and when a team makes it impossible for you to do your job it is time to talk to the coach. We are all human and we all handle pain differently. I did a 12 and under rec. game several years ago. Pitcher didn’t have a lot of velocity but it was still hard enough to hurt when it hit. The only thing the catcher was doing was giving me a little shade from the sun and not dong a good job at that. I kept getting hit on the hands, arms and legs. I still stuck with it. Even with shin guards it still stings if you get hit so you start dodging. I got hit on the side of the leg and notice it stung a little more than some of the others. Finally the coach came out and said he needed to change the pitcher. I looked at him and said he needed to change the catcher too because I am getting beat to death. He just looked at me and went on about his business. I made it through the game with the same catcher. I didn’t have to worry about calling strikes because they never got one in the zone. After the game I started to take my shin guards off and couldn’t un-hook one of the straps. The pitch that hurt so bad had mashed the hook shut. I had to use a screwdriver to pull the hook back apart.

[Robmoz]

Originally posted by WinterWillie

Not really, at a varsity game last week, I had one go between the catcher's legs and bounce straight up. The cup didn't help one bit. I lost the count!

It was two balls and one strike!