Annual rant about poor NFHS test question writing

[CecilOne]

Deliberately tricky wording about rare occurrences.

It is not obstruction if an errant throw pulls the first base player without the ball into the path of the batter-runner, and impedes her progress.
a. True
b. False
Explanation 2-36; 8-4-3
OK, if only attempting to catch.

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A pitcher is required to pitch until the first batter facing her has completed her turn at bat or the side has been retired.
a. True
b. False
Explanation 8-9-2


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Very Ambiguous

R1 is on first base; B2 is at bat with an 0-2 count and no outs. B2 swings at a third strike that is dropped by the catcher. B2 runs toward first base. As R1 is diving back to first base, B2 is hit in the back with F2's throw to first base and the ball goes out of play. What is the result of the play?
a. B2 is awarded second base; R1 is awarded third base.
b. B2 is declared out for interference; R1 remains at first base.
c. B2 is declared out for interference; R1 is awarded second base.
d. B2 has struck out; R1 remains at first base.
e. B2 has struck out and is charged with interference; R1 is declared out as the runner closest to home.
Explanation 8-6-16c Penalty
As discussed, it could be INT if judged so as hindering fielder’s catch, HTBT.
The throw was late enough that R1 had time to advance, react, then return to dive back.

[UmpireErnie]

It's a good thing we umpire actual plays in real time instead of words on paper.

[CecilOne]

Nonsense questions

For purposes of an appeal, when a runner passes a base she is considered to have touched it.
a. True
b. False
Explanation 8-3-4
What does “purposes of an appeal” mean, if not that it is a missed base if appealed.
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The DP and the FLEX are locked into the same position in the batting order.
a. True
b. False
Explanation 3-3-6g
The “explanation" only says the FLEX in the wrong position is illegal substitution.
The DP and FLEX are not shown in the same position, the FLEX is on line 10 and can move to the DP line.
Although everyone is "locked" in the batting order.

[DaveASA/FED]

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The DP and the FLEX are locked into the same position in the batting order.
a. True
b. False
Explanation 3-3-6g
The “explanation" only says the FLEX in the wrong position is illegal substitution.
The DP and FLEX are not shown in the same position, the FLEX is on line 10 and can move to the DP line.
Although everyone is "locked" in the batting order.[/QUOTE]

Since the flex is not technically in the batting order (2-7-1) at the start of the game, they are listed in the 10th position on the lineup(3-3-6b), but are not an offesive player. And since the FLEX can only legally bat for the DP (3-3-6d&e) than I think the statement that they are locked to the same position in the batting order is easily True.

2-7-1
ART. 1 . . . Batting Order. The batting order is the official list of starting offensive players presented in the order in which they are to bat and recorded on a lineup card.
3-3-6b
b. The name of the player for whom the DP is batting (FLEX) will be placed in the 10th position in the lineup.
3-3-6d
d. The DP may be substituted for at any time by a legal substitute or the FLEX may play offense for the DP. In either case, the DP will leave the game. If replaced by a substitute, the DP position remains in the lineup. A starting DP may re-enter one time, provided the DP returns to the original position in the batting order.

[CecilOne]

Originally Posted by DaveASA/FED

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The DP and the FLEX are locked into the same position in the batting order.
a. True
b. False
Explanation 3-3-6g
The “explanation" only says the FLEX in the wrong position is illegal substitution.
The DP and FLEX are not shown in the same position, the FLEX is on line 10 and can move to the DP line.
Although everyone is "locked" in the batting order.

Since the flex is not technically in the batting order (2-7-1) at the start of the game, they are listed in the 10th position on the lineup(3-3-6b), but are not an offesive player. And since the FLEX can only legally bat for the DP (3-3-6d&e) than I think the statement that they are locked to the same position in the batting order is easily True.

2-7-1
ART. 1 . . . Batting Order. The batting order is the official list of starting offensive players presented in the order in which they are to bat and recorded on a lineup card.
3-3-6b
b. The name of the player for whom the DP is batting (FLEX) will be placed in the 10th position in the lineup.
3-3-6d
d. The DP may be substituted for at any time by a legal substitute or the FLEX may play offense for the DP. In either case, the DP will leave the game. If replaced by a substitute, the DP position remains in the lineup. A starting DP may re-enter one time, provided the DP returns to the original position in the batting order.[/QUOTE]

I know, it was my suspicion about the testers throwing in comparisons to other rule books that got me. Someone shows both on the DP line, or used to.

[IRISHMAFIA]

For purposes of an appeal, when a runner passes a base she is considered to have touched it.
a. True
b. False
Explanation 8-3-4
What does “purposes of an appeal” mean, if not that it is a missed base if appealed.

The answer should be false. The runner who passes a base is considered to have touched that base for the purpose of all rules including awards, but not for the purpose of appeals.

[CecilOne]

Originally Posted by UmpireErnie

It's a good thing we umpire actual plays in real time instead of words on paper.

AMEN !!

[SWFLguy]

Retired high school teacher here of 32 years. Actually studied test construction in college and put it work work in my career. The True or False items in sports official's tests often end up as reading tests and not a valid test of an official's ability to make correct calls on the field. A well constructed multiple choice test is more reliable/valid. They are not that difficult to construct. In a perfect world, those are the kind of tests we would be taking. See SAT's and such as an example.

[illinoisbluezeb]

Originally Posted by SWFLguy

Retired high school teacher here of 32 years. Actually studied test construction in college and put it work work in my career. The True or False items in sports official's tests often end up as reading tests and not a valid test of an official's ability to make correct calls on the field. A well constructed multiple choice test is more reliable/valid. They are not that difficult to construct. In a perfect world, those are the kind of tests we would be taking. See SAT's and such as an example.

So Illinois has done something correctly !!!!
IHSA has been using multiple choice questions for a few years now.
Only 25-30 questions.

[teebob21]

Originally Posted by CecilOne

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Very Ambiguous

R1 is on first base; B2 is at bat with an 0-2 count and no outs. B2 swings at a third strike that is dropped by the catcher. B2 runs toward first base. As R1 is diving back to first base, B2 is hit in the back with F2's throw to first base and the ball goes out of play. What is the result of the play?
a. B2 is awarded second base; R1 is awarded third base.
b. B2 is declared out for interference; R1 remains at first base.
c. B2 is declared out for interference; R1 is awarded second base.
d. B2 has struck out; R1 remains at first base.
e. B2 has struck out and is charged with interference; R1 is declared out as the runner closest to home.
Explanation 8-6-16c Penalty
As discussed, it could be INT if judged so as hindering fielder’s catch, HTBT.
The throw was late enough that R1 had time to advance, react, then return to dive back.

Wait wait wait. There are no outs and 1st base is occupied. B2 swings at a third strike SO SHE HAS STRUCK OUT FULL STOP. Anything that happens after that is irrelevant to B2. B2's next destination is the dugout, not 2B.

Am I missing something here? B2 is out and R1 can be awarded 3B on the thrown ball to dead ball territory. Or maybe it's INT, although 8-6-16c says offensive team INT is not applicable to a BR running on the dropped third strike rule. HTBT, of course. This player is NOT entitled to run as a BR under the D3K rule, though; she's out already. Answer: (f), no correct answer but (e) is plausible. A thrown ball has gone out of play, so absent an INT ruling, R1 isn't staying at 1B. (A) is the least correct answer, because it's wrong unless I have completely boned the third-strike rule.

[chapmaja]

Originally Posted by teebob21

Wait wait wait. There are no outs and 1st base is occupied. B2 swings at a third strike SO SHE HAS STRUCK OUT FULL STOP. Anything that happens after that is irrelevant to B2. B2's next destination is the dugout, not 2B.

Am I missing something here? B2 is out and R1 can be awarded 3B on the thrown ball to dead ball territory. Or maybe it's INT, although 8-6-16c says offensive team INT is not applicable to a BR running on the dropped third strike rule. HTBT, of course. This player is NOT entitled to run as a BR under the D3K rule, though; she's out already. Answer: (f), no correct answer but (e) is plausible. A thrown ball has gone out of play, so absent an INT ruling, R1 isn't staying at 1B. (A) is the least correct answer, because it's wrong unless I have completely boned the third-strike rule.

I'm glad I am not the only one who caught this.

[JDM]

Why couldn't the B2 attempt to get to 1st if the R1 was attempting to get to 2nd at the beginning of the play?

[youngump]

Originally Posted by JDM

Why couldn't the B2 attempt to get to 1st if the R1 was attempting to get to 2nd at the beginning of the play?

Because those are the rules. 1st has to be open at the time of pitch or there must be 2 outs for the B to become a BR on a dropped third strike.

[JDM]

If R1 doesn't go to 2nd with 2 outs on a dropped 3rd strike, could the fielders tag R1 standing on 1st for a out or is the batter out if the R1 doesn't try to advance to 2nd?

[Dakota]

Originally Posted by JDM

If R1 doesn't go to 2nd with 2 outs on a dropped 3rd strike, could the fielders tag R1 standing on 1st for a out or is the batter out if the R1 doesn't try to advance to 2nd?

I auggest you take this back to basics rather than thinking of the runner's and BR's status being different because it was a D3K.

With less than 2 outs and 1B empty at the time of the pitch or with 2 outs, if strike 3 is uncaught, the batter becomes a batter-runner.

Everything after that is exactly the same as for any other reason the batter becomes a batter-runner.