Rule Clarification - GK Handling

[phatneff]

Is it documented anywhere what the violation is when the GK crosses over the PA line while in the act of punting the ball (ball is still in hands as the line is crossed)?

This happened yesterday in a tournament game and my partner in the 2-man system made the call and awarded an IFK. I believed it should have been a DFK because when the GK comes out of the PA, he/she becomes a field player. Hence, handling is a DFK.

After the game, I discussed it with him and he said he was always told it was an IFK. I told him I'd find out and send it to him. However, I can't find it anywhere.

[bainsey]

Originally Posted by phatneff

This happened yesterday in a tournament game and my partner in the 2-man system made the call and awarded an IFK. I believed it should have been a DFK because when the GK comes out of the PA, he/she becomes a field player. Hence, handling is a DFK.

You are correct. It's as simple as NFHS Rule 12-2, see exception.

It sounds like your partner is confusing the penalty with other keeper infractions inside the box, namely the "six seconds" or "pass back" rules.

[CMHCoachNRef]

Originally Posted by phatneff

Is it documented anywhere what the violation is when the GK crosses over the PA line while in the act of punting the ball (ball is still in hands as the line is crossed)?

This happened yesterday in a tournament game and my partner in the 2-man system made the call and awarded an IFK. I believed it should have been a DFK because when the GK comes out of the PA, he/she becomes a field player. Hence, handling is a DFK.

After the game, I discussed it with him and he said he was always told it was an IFK. I told him I'd find out and send it to him. However, I can't find it anywhere.

The "Trifling" comes to mind.....

[bainsey]

Originally Posted by CMHCoachNRef

The "Trifling" comes to mind.....

You'd be surprised how many want it called, nonetheless.

A few weeks ago, I had a boys' varsity game where the visiting keeper was quite adept at releasing the ball at the top of the box and punting it when he's outside of it, which is legal.

A fan yells from behind me, "He's kicking it outside the box."

I'm thinking, he's saying it wrong. He meant, he's handling it outside the box, which he wasn't.

A few minutes later, the same thing: "He's kicking it outside the box!"

Hmmm, he DID mean what he said. This was a cold, blustery day, and most people were watching the game from inside their vehicles. There were about 5-7 people standing to watch the game. Normally, I don't like fan interaction during the game, but this was hardly a hostile environment.

I turn my head slightly and say, "That's legal. HANDLING outside the box is illegal."

"Really?!?"

That was pretty cool. A nice little rules lesson for the guy.

"Show me the rule!"

Wow.

[CMHCoachNRef]

Originally Posted by bainsey

You'd be surprised how many want it called, nonetheless.

I won't argue that they WANT it called....But, how many DEFENSIVE followers want that called? ANSWER: ZERO.....Unless the keeper is doing it on a repeated basis -- and it is CLEAR that he is still handling the ball outside the area -- let the dang thing go.....WARN the keeper if need be....

The penalty is HUGE -- DFK from 18.0001 yards from the goal line....Make sure that the crime fits that penalty!!!

[phatneff]

Originally Posted by CMHCoachNRef

The "Trifling" comes to mind.....

Trifling or not, that isn't the question.

[CMHCoachNRef]

Originally Posted by phatneff

Trifling or not, that isn't the question.

It SHOULD be!!! Pretty easy to remember what is indirect vs. a direct kick....Foul involving CONTACT (or attempted contact in the case of spitting, kicking, striking, etc.) is direct (including handling) except for the obscure "charge away from the ball"....which is indirect...
Non-contact fouls/Offside are indirect (including things like OS, DP, Obstruction, etc. AND administrative violations committed by a GK WITHIN his own penalty area)....
In this case, the foul involves the GK OUTSIDE his own penalty area, therefore the penalty is a DFK....

And, once again, unless previously warned OR blatantly obvious..."trifling" IMO....

[phatneff]

Originally Posted by CMHCoachNRef

It SHOULD be!!! Pretty easy to remember what is indirect vs. a direct kick....Foul involving CONTACT (or attempted contact in the case of spitting, kicking, striking, etc.) is direct (including handling) except for the obscure "charge away from the ball"....which is indirect...
Non-contact fouls/Offside are indirect (including things like OS, DP, Obstruction, etc. AND administrative violations committed by a GK WITHIN his own penalty area)....
In this case, the foul involves the GK OUTSIDE his own penalty area, therefore the penalty is a DFK....

And, once again, unless previously warned OR blatantly obvious..."trifling" IMO....

Apparently, you're not understanding my question. This isn't about remembering what's an IFK or DFK, nor is it about whether or not it should be called. The question was, because it WAS called by someone, and I tried to explain to him why it should have been a DFK instead of IFK, and him saying that he was told differently, if it was DOCUMENTED somewhere so that it could be shared with him so that he would call it correctly the next time, should he CHOOSE to do that?!?!?! Got it?

[CMHCoachNRef]

Originally Posted by phatneff

Apparently, you're not understanding my question. This isn't about remembering what's an IFK or DFK, nor is it about whether or not it should be called. The question was, because it WAS called by someone, and I tried to explain to him why it should have been a DFK instead of IFK, and him saying that he was told differently, if it was DOCUMENTED somewhere so that it could be shared with him so that he would call it correctly the next time, should he CHOOSE to do that?!?!?! Got it?

Phat,
I GOT IT the first time. My points remain. When we are on the pitch, we don't have the luxury of being able to find out where it is DOCUMENTED. We have to REMEMBER it. The original reply told you where it was DOCUMENTED. In order to prevent the mistake by your partner from happening again, he or she must REMEMBER what is DOCUMENTED. Obviously you KNEW (and had already REMEMBERED) what is DOCUMENTED. Your partner had not.

Therefore, how to prevent the situation from happening again?
1. Remind referees that the penalty for this foul is very high -- make sure that the game needs this foul to be called to keep the game fair.
2. Remind referees of an easy way to remember the penalty for direct kick fouls vs. indirect kick fouls.

You continue to point out your narrow question/answer. I am merely expanding the thought process to decrease the likelihood that a similar scenario would unfold in a future contest. No more, no less.