Blocking a receiver Question

[Juxone]

If a legal receiver is running down field and is blocked (without first making contact) before a pass isn't this an illegal block and treated as a holding call, 2) if the ball is in the air does this think become defensiveness pass interference? I ask this after reading the rule 7-5-10 Rule: 7-5-10

It is forward-pass interference if:
a. Any player of A or B who is beyond the neutral zone interferes with an eligible opponent's opportunity to move toward, catch or bat the pass.

[Cliffdweller]

1. No
2. Yes (DPI)

[JRutledge]

It is never a penalty if the offensive player is acting like a blocker. Then the defender can hit them if they are an eligible receiver, unless of course the ball is in the air and in the direction of that receiver.

Peace

[HLin NC]

He is a potential blocker until he has achieved the same yard line or is moving past the defender and the pass has not been thrown.

[Welpe]

Originally Posted by JRutledge

It is never a penalty if the offensive player is acting like a blocker. Then the defender can hit them if they are an eligible receiver, unless of course the ball is in the air and in the direction of that receiver.

Peace

This.

and

Originally Posted by HLin NC

He is a potential blocker until he has achieved the same yard line or is moving past the defender and the pass has not been thrown.

This.

There is no "illegal contact" in NFHS or NCAA rules like there is in the NFL (which this year means the defender breathed heavily on the receiver). The only potential foul you could have is illegal use of the hands if and only if the receiver being blocked is no longer a potential blocker as HLinNC defined above.

[bisonlj]

Originally Posted by Welpe

The only potential foul you could have is illegal use of the hands if and only if the receiver being blocked is no longer a potential blocker as HLinNC defined above.

You could have holding if he grasps or restricts the receiver in a manner other than a legal block.

[Welpe]

I was talking about a standard block, not holding, blocking below the waist or anything else of the nature.

[Reffing Rev.]

I had a wing report defensive holding and unfortunately my only question was whether or not the ball was in the air yet. He said no we enforced it...post-game the BJ chimed in he thought it was legal contact so the conversation finally happened...as has been said unless the receiver is even with or passed or his restricted (held) this is legal contact.

[JRutledge]

Originally Posted by Reffing Rev.

I had a wing report defensive holding and unfortunately my only question was whether or not the ball was in the air yet. He said no we enforced it...post-game the BJ chimed in he thought it was legal contact so the conversation finally happened...as has been said unless the receiver is even with or passed or his restricted (held) this is legal contact.

There is more to it than where the receiver is in relationship to the yard line the defender is on. If the receiver is clearly running a route, then you have to have a foul. But this is where football IQ comes into play, you often know when there is doubt.

My question in this case about your post game, why is the BJ coming in after the game giving that information? That should have been information given before you enforced the penalty.

Peace

[Juxone]

"It is never a penalty if the offensive player is acting like a blocker. Then the defender can hit them if they are an eligible receiver, unless of course the ball is in the air and in the direction of that receiver. "

I am actually talking about an offensive player who is or appears to be running a route and does NOT attempt to make contact with B-- Offensive player runs 10 yards and makes a post and is contacted by B before the pass .. ??

[Juxone]

Originally Posted by JRutledge

There is more to it than where the receiver is in relationship to the yard line the defender is on. If the receiver is clearly running a route, then you have to have a foul. But this is where football IQ comes into play, you often know when there is doubt.

I think the part of "..If the receiver is clearly running a route, then you have to have a foul." answers my question, it is a foul regardless and if the ball is in the air it become DPI??

So if the ball is NOT in the air what is the call?? Holding?

[Welpe]

Originally Posted by Juxone

"It is never a penalty if the offensive player is acting like a blocker. Then the defender can hit them if they are an eligible receiver, unless of course the ball is in the air and in the direction of that receiver. "

I am actually talking about an offensive player who is or appears to be running a route and does NOT attempt to make contact with B-- Offensive player runs 10 yards and makes a post and is contacted by B before the pass .. ??

The generally accepted interpretation is that if a receiver is before or on the same yard line as the defender, it is legal to block him. This is codified at least in the NCAA rules but I don't believe it is in NFHS.

Originally Posted by Juxone

I think the part of "..If the receiver is clearly running a route, then you have to have a foul." answers my question, it is a foul regardless and if the ball is in the air it become DPI??

If the ball is in the air and in the direction of the receiver, it is a DPI. If it is thrown away from the receiver then it is nothing.

So if the ball is NOT in the air what is the call?? Holding?

If the ball is not in the air it's either holding or illegal use of the hands. Holding if he's grabbed and restricted, illegal use of the hands if he's simply blocked while no longer a potential blocker as defined above.

[Reffing Rev.]

The wording of the rule states: a "potential blocker", not an actual blocker, not trying to be a blocker, but a "potential blocker." (I wish I had a rule book here)

When does the receiver stop being a potential blocker? When he is head and shoulders even or past the defender.

As long as the contact is not a personal foul or pass interference, and there is not restriction/holding, then for the defender to engage a potential blocker is legal. Once the receiver avoids and evades the defender and gets even with him or beyond him, then it is illegal use of the hands for the defender to initiate contact.

Otherwise...you are going to have to move to the NFL's 5 yard "chuck" zone.

(BTW: I thoroughly admonished the BJ for not bringing his voice to the on-field conference, and the next week we had a healthy discussion in pre-game about communicating potentially useful information on the field.)

[JRutledge]

Originally Posted by Reffing Rev.

The wording of the rule states: a "potential blocker", not an actual blocker, not trying to be a blocker, but a "potential blocker." (I wish I had a rule book here)

When does the receiver stop being a potential blocker? When he is head and shoulders even or past the defender.

Routes are not always run while running by someone. You can run a route in front of a defender. So if the receiver is not running at the defender, I do not consider them to be much of a blocker anymore. So using that standard of being head and shoulders past a defender is not going to work when you are running a curl route or even a slant. You need a little more to that philosophy to know when to make that call. I see linebackers just hit a receiver that is in front of them and running away from them, but they hit them anyway and coaches think that is the case and get upset when you throw a flag. Usually these are a "talk to" and they are most often not that egregious, but still could be a foul under the right circumstance.

Peace

[Juxone]

Thanks all this helped.