AFC Championship - was that a TD?

[APG]

Originally Posted by just another ref

What does this mean? Survive the hit or ground?

NFL Rule Book (2011-2012)

Rule 8, Section 1

COMPLETED OR INTERCEPTED PASS

Article 3 Completed or Intercepted Pass. A player who makes a catch may advance the ball. A forward pass is complete (by the offense) or intercepted (by the defense) if a player, who is inbounds:

(a) secures control of the ball in his hands or arms prior to the ball touching the ground; and

(b) touches the ground inbounds with both feet or with any part of his body other than his hands; and

(c) maintains control of the ball long enough, after (a) and (b) have been fulfilled, to enable him to perform any act common to the game (i.e., maintaining control long enough to pitch it, pass it, advance with it, or avoid or ward off an opponent, etc.).

Note 1: It is not necessary that he commit such an act, provided that he maintains control of the ball long enough to do so.

Note 2: If a player has control of the ball, a slight movement of the ball will not be considered a loss of possession. He must lose control of the ball in order to rule that there has been a loss of possession. If the player loses the ball while simultaneously touching both feet or any part of his body other than his hands to the ground, or if there is any doubt that the acts were simultaneous, it is not a catch.

Item 1: Player Going to the Ground. If a player goes to the ground in the act of catching a pass (with or without contact by an opponent), he must maintain control of the ball throughout the process of contacting the ground, whether in the field of play or the end zone. If he loses control of the ball,and the ball touches the ground before he regains control, the pass is incomplete. If he regains control prior to the ball touching the ground, the pass is complete.

[rockyroad]

Originally Posted by AllPurposeGamer

NFL Rule Book (2011-2012)

Rule 8, Section 1

COMPLETED OR INTERCEPTED PASS

Article 3 Completed or Intercepted Pass. A player who makes a catch may advance the ball. A forward pass is complete (by the offense) or intercepted (by the defense) if a player, who is inbounds:

(a) secures control of the ball in his hands or arms prior to the ball touching the ground; and

(b) touches the ground inbounds with both feet or with any part of his body other than his hands; and

(c) maintains control of the ball long enough, after (a) and (b) have been fulfilled, to enable him to perform any act common to the game (i.e., maintaining control long enough to pitch it, pass it, advance with it, or avoid or ward off an opponent, etc.).

Note 1: It is not necessary that he commit such an act, provided that he maintains control of the ball long enough to do so.

Note 2: If a player has control of the ball, a slight movement of the ball will not be considered a loss of possession. He must lose control of the ball in order to rule that there has been a loss of possession. If the player loses the ball while simultaneously touching both feet or any part of his body other than his hands to the ground, or if there is any doubt that the acts were simultaneous, it is not a catch.

Item 1: Player Going to the Ground. If a player goes to the ground in the act of catching a pass (with or without contact by an opponent), he must maintain control of the ball throughout the process of contacting the ground, whether in the field of play or the end zone. If he loses control of the ball,and the ball touches the ground before he regains control, the pass is incomplete. If he regains control prior to the ball touching the ground, the pass is complete.

So if he had gotten that second foot down before the defender knocked the ball out of his hands, would it have been a TD? Or would he have had to take another step?

[bob jenkins]

Originally Posted by rockyroad

So if he had gotten that second foot down before the defender knocked the ball out of his hands, would it have been a TD? Or would he have had to take another step?

That meets (a) and (b) so it would be the judgment of the official as to whether (c) was met.

[APG]

Originally Posted by rockyroad

So if he had gotten that second foot down before the defender knocked the ball out of his hands, would it have been a TD? Or would he have had to take another step?

It's a judgement call as to whether the player was able to perform a football move. Even if that second foot would have gotten down, the hit was simultaneous to the second foot coming down and by rule, that would be incomplete (look at note 2).

[JRutledge]

Originally Posted by AllPurposeGamer

It's a judgement call as to whether the player was able to perform a football move. Even if that second foot would have gotten down, the hit was simultaneous to the second foot coming down and by rule, that would be incomplete (look at note 2).

The hit could have come a second later after the second foot came down and he had not controlled the ball and made a "football move" it is still incomplete. The feet coming down is only apart of a catch, other things have to happen to complete that catch. And as I stated before, it it would not be ruled a catch an a fumble in the middle of the field, it certainly is not going to be ruled the same at in the end zone.

Peace

[APG]

Originally Posted by JRutledge

The hit could have come a second later after the second foot came down and he had not controlled the ball and made a "football move" it is still incomplete. The feet coming down is only apart of a catch, other things have to happen to complete that catch. And as I stated before, it it would not be ruled a catch an a fumble in the middle of the field, it certainly is not going to be ruled the same at in the end zone.

Peace

I agree...there's an element of time involved in making a catch...a lot of people assume ball in hand+two feet=instant catch...if this were true, there would be a lot of "cheap" fumbles.

[rockyroad]

Originally Posted by JRutledge

The hit could have come a second later after the second foot came down and he had not controlled the ball and made a "football move" it is still incomplete. The feet coming down is only apart of a catch, other things have to happen to complete that catch. And as I stated before, it it would not be ruled a catch an a fumble in the middle of the field, it certainly is not going to be ruled the same at in the end zone.

Peace

So if this was a HS game and you were on that play, would you have ruled it a TD, Jeff? Just trying to understand the rule better without having to listen to the mouths on the tv...

[JRutledge]

Originally Posted by rockyroad

So if this was a HS game and you were on that play, would you have ruled it a TD, Jeff? Just trying to understand the rule better without having to listen to the mouths on the tv...

No I would not. And fortunately or unfortunately I was on YouTube with a similar call in my State Final game in November. I use the same basic philosophy in both HS and college games. And unlike D1 college or most HS games, we have no replay. You better hand me the ball after all of that if I did not rule you made a football move before hitting the ground or getting hit by a defender. And at those levels they need just one foot down in most cases (they can be pushed out to complete a pass).

Peace

[TXMike]

Originally Posted by JRutledge

And unlike D1 college or most HS games, we have no replay. You better hand me the ball after all of that if I did not rule you made a football move before hitting the ground or getting hit by a defender. And at those levels they need just one foot down in most cases (they can be pushed out to complete a pass).

Peace

Are you saying that if the receiver does not get a foot down but is pushed out thus preventing the foot down , then it can still be a completion? Don't have a clue about NFHS but that is not the case in NCAA.

[TXMike]

Originally Posted by JRutledge

I use the same basic philosophy in both HS and college games. And unlike D1 college or most HS games, we have no replay. You better hand me the ball after all of that if I did not rule you made a football move before hitting the ground or getting hit by a defender. And at those levels they need just one foot down in most cases (they can be pushed out to complete a pass).

Peace

You indicated at "those levels" (plural) which makes it appear you are referring to HS and college.