The Official Forum  

Go Back   The Official Forum > Football

Reply
 
LinkBack Thread Tools Rate Thread Display Modes
  #1 (permalink)  
Old Fri Apr 18, 2003, 10:14am
JMN JMN is offline
Official Forum Member
 
Join Date: Dec 2002
Posts: 296
I thought that I would call on the combined wisdom of this board (I miss Derock) to discuss a topic I don't think is avaibable for review in any mechanics manual. Maybe it's too easy to understand.

Under the NFHS and NCAA codes, in which situations is it mandatory to drop a bean bag? I know the mechanics differ a bit between codes. Please be specific with which code you're citing when posting.

Thanks, fellas.
Reply With Quote
  #2 (permalink)  
Old Fri Apr 18, 2003, 11:10am
Official Forum Member
 
Join Date: May 2000
Posts: 1,464
Buy youself a copy of the Officals Manual from the NFHS.
All the conditions for using a bag are documented there.
It's on those books that has a lot of good stuff in it, like mechanics for 4 and 5 man games.
We get it every other year (only updated every other year) as part of our chapter dues.
Reply With Quote
  #3 (permalink)  
Old Sat Apr 19, 2003, 12:21pm
JMN JMN is offline
Official Forum Member
 
Join Date: Dec 2002
Posts: 296
Thanks, Theisey.

Can't believe in all these years that we never got one!

How about NCAA?
Reply With Quote
  #4 (permalink)  
Old Sat Apr 19, 2003, 07:03pm
Official Forum Member
 
Join Date: May 2000
Posts: 1,464
there is a summary page in each of the CAA mechanics manuals, which we use in NCAA games.
Reply With Quote
  #5 (permalink)  
Old Thu Apr 24, 2003, 08:50am
Official Forum Member
 
Join Date: Aug 1999
Posts: 1,130
Quote:
Originally posted by JMN
I thought that I would call on the combined wisdom of this board (I miss Derock) to discuss a topic I don't think is avaibable for review in any mechanics manual. Maybe it's too easy to understand.

Under the NFHS and NCAA codes, in which situations is it mandatory to drop a bean bag? I know the mechanics differ a bit between codes. Please be specific with which code you're citing when posting.

Thanks, fellas.
NFHS Officials Manual states:

A. The bean bag is to be dropped on the appropriate yard line in accordance with the situations calling for such action in this manual.

B. The bean bag is to serve as an aid to enforcement and not an absolute reference point.

Here are my instructions to my crew on using the bean bag.

- When the player possession is lost during the down - mandatory
- When you need to mark a spot and then to tend to the players

The new one this coming season, when possession of the ball following a scrimmage kick occurs. With the PSK enforcement this season you have to be able to mark the enforcement spot. In previous seasons, you returned to the previous spot.

One last and important caveat, DO NOT use your beanbag to throw at a spot. If you can't hustle to a spot, then unhustle yourself to another crew.
__________________
Ed Hickland, MBA, CCP
ehicklan@optonline.net
Reply With Quote
  #6 (permalink)  
Old Fri Apr 25, 2003, 07:29am
Official Forum Member
 
Join Date: Jul 2002
Posts: 2
One More

There is at least one additional beanbagable situation for both FED and NCAA that I'm sure you include... marking the spot when ruling momentum.
__________________
VA-Ump
Reply With Quote
  #7 (permalink)  
Old Tue Apr 29, 2003, 01:32pm
Official Forum Member
 
Join Date: Apr 2003
Posts: 1
Bean Bags

In regards to the Bean Bag question posted earlier, it is proper to drop a bean bag on those situations where possession is lost. Keep in mind that snaps from center and backward passes are not possession lost situations.

In addition, this year in Federation, officials need to drop a bean bag where a scrimmage kick is successfully fielded in the field of play so as to mark the Post Scrimmage kick spot (PSK) for penalty enforcement.
Reply With Quote
  #8 (permalink)  
Old Wed Apr 30, 2003, 09:40am
Official Forum Member
 
Join Date: Jun 2001
Location: Clinton Township, NJ
Posts: 2,065
HeyRef...one correction...

You mention that a backward pass is not (??) a lost possession situation. I disagree. If a backward pass from beyond the neutral zone occurs, you had better mark the spot with a bean bag. That spot is the end of the related run and may become the spot of enforcement for a foul by the offense that occurs after the pass and before possession of the loose ball is regained. Correct?
__________________
Bob M.
Reply With Quote
  #9 (permalink)  
Old Wed Apr 30, 2003, 12:26pm
Official Forum Member
 
Join Date: Jun 2001
Location: Clinton Township, NJ
Posts: 2,065
To be a little more precise...

Quote:
Originally posted by Bob M.
...That spot is the end of the related run and may become the spot of enforcement for a foul by the offense that occurs after the pass and before possession of the loose ball is regained....
Actually, to be more precise, the spot of the backward pass may become the enforcement spot for a foul by the offense during the pass, and will become the spot of enforcement for defensive fouls during the pass.
__________________
Bob M.
Reply With Quote
  #10 (permalink)  
Old Wed Apr 30, 2003, 12:43pm
Official Forum Member
 
Join Date: May 2002
Posts: 229
As a general rule, I was taught to bean bag fumbles, muffs and where punt's are caught. Some people do interceptions and backward passes, but I don't know that I understand the value.
__________________
Strange women, lying in ponds, distributing swords is no basis for a system of government. If I went around claiming I was an emperor just because some moistened bink lobbed a scimitar at me, they would put me away.
-Monty Python-
Reply With Quote
  #11 (permalink)  
Old Wed Apr 30, 2003, 02:07pm
Official Forum Member
 
Join Date: Jun 2002
Posts: 489
Lightbulb Team possession versus player possession...

Bob brings up some good points...

We need to mark the spot where the run ends for penalty enforcement.

For example, at the spot of the backward pass made beyond the neutral zone.

Player possession is given up at this spot, but team possession remains the same unless the defense intercepts or recovers the backwards pass.

Therefore we must be alert to know the sequence of events in order to properly administer the play.

Hey Sleeper, I've been a big fan of Monty Python for almost the past 30 years. How is your semi-pro officiating going? Our league starts a week from Saturday...

__________________
Mike Simonds
Reply With Quote
  #12 (permalink)  
Old Wed Apr 30, 2003, 02:56pm
Official Forum Member
 
Join Date: May 2002
Posts: 229
I had a good game during the pre-season and got picked up as a substitute. I am hoping for a more regular spot when one opens up. I found another league that needed help and I am hoping to work some there as well. I also picked up a 7 on 7 tournament. I am trying to get as many games as possible to suppliement my offseason workout I started a couple of weeks ago.

I have the two CD set of Monty Python's Greatest hits. Keeps me sane (although my sanity may be questionable at best).
__________________
Strange women, lying in ponds, distributing swords is no basis for a system of government. If I went around claiming I was an emperor just because some moistened bink lobbed a scimitar at me, they would put me away.
-Monty Python-
Reply With Quote
  #13 (permalink)  
Old Wed Apr 30, 2003, 08:26pm
Official Forum Member
 
Join Date: May 2000
Posts: 1,464
Quote:
Originally posted by Sleeper
..... Some people do interceptions and backward passes, but I don't know that I understand the value.
The value is this:
-Momentum may be involved on an interception.

-The spot of the backward pass when beyond the NZ is the end of a run and could be an enforcement spot for fouls by team-A
Reply With Quote
  #14 (permalink)  
Old Wed Apr 30, 2003, 09:03pm
Official Forum Member
 
Join Date: Aug 1999
Posts: 1,130
Re: HeyRef...one correction...

Quote:
Originally posted by Bob M.
You mention that a backward pass is not (??) a lost possession situation. I disagree. If a backward pass from beyond the neutral zone occurs, you had better mark the spot with a bean bag. That spot is the end of the related run and may become the spot of enforcement for a foul by the offense that occurs after the pass and before possession of the loose ball is regained. Correct?
You are both correct. A backward pass involves a loss of player possession but not a loss of team possession.

You should drop a bean bag anytime player possession is lost becuase that will be the spot where the run ends and as Bob M mentioned it becomes the basic spot for enforcement.

On a backward pass or any loose ball play or situation the ball remains in team possession until the other team gains possession. It is important to note when that occurs because the time of the foul and how it is enforced may depend upon who has possession.
__________________
Ed Hickland, MBA, CCP
ehicklan@optonline.net
Reply With Quote
  #15 (permalink)  
Old Thu May 01, 2003, 12:34pm
Official Forum Member
 
Join Date: Jun 2001
Location: Clinton Township, NJ
Posts: 2,065
Quote:
Originally posted by Sleeper
As a general rule, I was taught to bean bag fumbles, muffs and where punt's are caught. Some people do interceptions and backward passes, but I don't know that I understand the value.
REPLY: Up until this season, there was no reason in Federation to bag the spot where a punt was caught unless it was inside B's 5 yardline and momentum was being ruled. Same for interceptions. This season, we'll need to bag the spot that punts are caught because of the potential for a PSK enforcement foul by B. However, I still contend that you absolutely must bag backward passes from beyond the neutral zone. Now, if it's a quick pass and possession is regained immediately, you can probably get away with leaving the bag tucked in your knickers, but if the pass falls loose, I would bag the spot of the pass immediately.
__________________
Bob M.
Reply With Quote
Reply

Bookmarks

Thread Tools
Display Modes Rate This Thread
Rate This Thread:

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is On
Trackbacks are On
Pingbacks are On
Refbacks are On



All times are GMT -5. The time now is 01:48am.



Search Engine Friendly URLs by vBSEO 3.3.0 RC1