Taking A Knee

[bcwhitehat]

We've all been there when a team is winning and they plan on taking a knee. Typically the HC will tell you that they are going to take a knee.

When you know they are going to do so, do you say anything to the defense?

[kdf5]

IF I say anything it's something to the effect of "be cool everyone".

[JugglingReferee]

I tell the defense that "they're taking a knee".

If A doesn't, then I blow it dead and issue a misleading tactics penatly.

[HLin NC]

This is an annual topic.

Some say nothing, some find a way to penalize A, some shut it down anyway, some say "be smart, be cool, if he takes a knee don't hit him, etc."

Then we argue about it.

[waltjp]

Originally Posted by HLin NC

This is an annual topic.

Some say nothing, some find a way to penalize A, some shut it down anyway, some say "be smart, be cool, if he takes a knee don't hit him, etc."

Then we argue about it.

We only argue because there's a faction that refuses to admit their wrong!

[ODJ]

Originally Posted by HLin NC

This is an annual topic.

Some say nothing, some find a way to penalize A, some shut it down anyway, some say "be smart, be cool, if he takes a knee don't hit him, etc."

Then we argue about it.

And I still read most of the posts.

[bigjohn]

He is always like that BroKen. He lashes out at me all the time on the NFHS board.

[MD Longhorn]

NEVER tell the defense what to do. Go into EVERY kneeling situation as if the offense is going to fake it. This might only happen to you once in a lifetime, or never, but if you aren't ready and/or you've told the defense what to do, then any fallout is your fault.

AT MOST - tell them something like, "If they take a knee, no nonsense." Or "Don't hit anyone after the whistle, boys." AT MOST.

At youth ball, you might want to be more specific, but unless the league has a sportsmanship rule forbidding fake knee-plays, you better preface your warning with IF.

[GoodwillRef]

Originally Posted by mbcrowder

NEVER tell the defense what to do. Go into EVERY kneeling situation as if the offense is going to fake it. This might only happen to you once in a lifetime, or never, but if you aren't ready and/or you've told the defense what to do, then any fallout is your fault.

AT MOST - tell them something like, "If they take a knee, no nonsense." Or "Don't hit anyone after the whistle, boys." AT MOST.

At youth ball, you might want to be more specific, but unless the league has a sportsmanship rule forbidding fake knee-plays, you better preface your warning with IF.

I always ask and if they tell me they are taking a knee I am telling everyone. If they fake it I am blowing it dead and flagging them for unsporting behavior.

[ppaltice]

When Team A tells me that they are taking a knee, I tell Team A that they still have to block and Team B to stop on the whistle. I don't want a situation where A bobbles the snap and Team B would have had a chance to regain possession, but we told them to play differently.

[mbyron]

Clearly we have 2 schools of thought here:

1. Facilitate a smooth and injury-free end of the game by publicizing A's intention to take a knee, and penalize A if they fail to follow through. The rationale for this policy is game management and player safety.

2. Never tell players what to do or put a team in a position where it cannot execute an otherwise legal play. The rationale for this policy is that the rules don't change at the end of a game.

Both rationales are legitimate, though obviously the policies are incompatible and neither finds support in the rule book. The best approach would be to consult your local association, find or establish an association policy for games in your area, and follow that policy.

[JasonTX]

Originally Posted by ppaltice

When Team A tells me that they are taking a knee, I tell Team A that they still have to block and Team B to stop on the whistle. I don't want a situation where A bobbles the snap and Team B would have had a chance to regain possession, but we told them to play differently.

I agree this is good. I usually don't say anything and I officiate the "kneel down" just like any other play. It is not our job to get involved with a play call because no matter what play is called at the line, the offense has every right to audible to another play.

For those others who get involved and shut it down. What do you do if the offense calls, "pitch right"? The defense hears it and aligns their formation to cover the run. The offense snaps and throw a deep pass for a TD. Anybody shutting that down for deceiving the defense into thinking it was going to be a run. Lesson for the defense. Don't listen to the play calling and be ready to go 100% on each play.

I had a game once where it was a "kneel down" call, but the snap was muffed. Luckily for the defense they were firing out at the snap and recovered the ball. Next play they scored the game winning TD. Imagine if I would have intervened and told them not to play.

[MD Longhorn]

Originally Posted by GoodwillRef

I always ask and if they tell me they are taking a knee I am telling everyone. If they fake it I am blowing it dead and flagging them for unsporting behavior.

So, basically you invent a rule to cover your own game mismanagement?

First off ... why would you ask? When do we ever ask the teams what the next play will be?

Second - if you tell defense not to play, and the ball is mishandled, you've put them at a disadvantage.

Third - if for some reason there is a reason offense needs to keep playing in what appears to YOU to be a knee situation, and you ask, and they say no - you've put THEM at a disadvantage. (Perhaps they are up by 6, but must win by 10 to make the playoffs)

Fourth - what if (3) above is true, and all week they worked on a fake-knee play for this VERY scenario ... now you've eliminated that option.

Granted 99% of the time you've done no harm. But it's the one time in 100 where your mismanagement of the situation affects the game in a negative way. No need to put yourself or the teams in this situation.

[JRutledge]

We ask the coach if they are taking a knee, then we tell the defense they are taking a knee. My umpire does tell the defense not to fire out, if the offense does not take a knee we shut it down (happened about 4 weeks ago). Then we penalize the offense for deception. Almost never a problem and what works for us.

Peace

[asdf]

Originally Posted by mbcrowder

NEVER tell the defense what to do. Go into EVERY kneeling situation as if the offense is going to fake it. This might only happen to you once in a lifetime, or never, but if you aren't ready and/or you've told the defense what to do, then any fallout is your fault.

AT MOST - tell them something like, "If they take a knee, no nonsense." Or "Don't hit anyone after the whistle, boys." AT MOST.

At youth ball, you might want to be more specific, but unless the league has a sportsmanship rule forbidding fake knee-plays, you better preface your warning with IF.

"Never" and "Every" ???

When's the last time you saw a 56-6 game end with the offense taking a knee and the defense going balls out to make the tackle?

You don't see it because the officials told the guys that "they are taking a knee."

When the situation calls for the announcement, announce it.

If you don't know if the siutation calls for it, then you have a lot of work to do.