kick off

[ajmc]

Originally Posted by ump33

HLin NC -

2-41-1 ... The basic spot is a point of reference for penalty enforcement. It is the previous spot for a loose-ball play unless the only accepted penalities meet the requirements of a PSK foul and the end of the run for a running play.

If this was scrimage kick and R blocks K below the waist at the line of scrimmage after which the ball/kick enters the endzone (touchback), would you use 10-4-5b and enforce from the suceeding spot? How does this differ from the OP other than a Free Kick versus a Scrimmage Kick?

It doesn't, ALL fouls that occur during either a free, or scrimmage, kick are loose ball fouls, with the exception of PSK fouls (which only apply during scrimmage kicks).

In the original question, the offended teams choice would be to accept the penalty and replay the down after enforcing a 15 yard penalty from the previous spot, or accept the result of the play, which would be a touchback.

If the foul had been a dead ball foul enforcement would be from the succeeding spot, which would be the R 20 yard line, following the touchback. Rekick would not be an option.

[jemiller]

I agree with AJMC. Nuff said, Jim

[VALJ]

I know I'm late to this party, but I had this exact situation occur earlier this season (the second time I ever worked as R). My umpire and I on the field came up with this resulting in a rekick, since it happened during the looseball play. I brought it up in my class the following week, and the class agreed that it's a rekick.

[JRod37]

Holy cow, you guys think of the good ones. Looks like there are a lot of ways to interpret this.

Seems to me the question is whether 10-4d trumps 10-4-2b or vice versa. They conflict, so which one wins?? By rule there can not be a play that results in a touchback that is not a loose ball play (although I realize 10-3-1 only speaks of kicks). Any non-loose ball play in A/K's end zone must be a safety.

Just some more fodder for the conversation. I'm not suggesting anyone is right or wrong.

[LDUB]

Originally Posted by JRod37

By rule there can not be a play that results in a touchback that is not a loose ball play (although I realize 10-3-1 only speaks of kicks). Any non-loose ball play in A/K's end zone must be a safety.

A snaps at the 50. A24 runs to B's 45 yard line and fumbles, B50 pick up the ball and runs to the A 2 yard line, fumbles and the ball rolls forward and goes out of bounds beyond the goal line. This is a safety?

This free kick enforcement isn't hard. It is a loose ball play until a running play starts. Fouls during the loose ball play are enforced from the previous spot.

[NorCalRef12]

There has been a lot of grief lately over rule 10-4-5d and I believe it comes from people reading into the rule.

10-4-5d is there to clarify what the enforcement should be if team A commits a foul during a running play by B that results in a touchback. If A1 throws a pass into B's end zone where B1 intercepts the pass, and B1 is subsequently brought down by the facemask in the end zone, the face mask penalty will be enforced from the succeeding spot, not the end of the run. If B1 chose to run out of the end zone and is brought down by the face mask at the B 2 yard line, the foul would be enforced from the end of the run and it would be first and 10 for B from the 17 yard line.

ABO is meant to be kept simple, don't read things into it. Just answer these questions. What foul was committed? Who committed the foul? When did the foul occur (Loose-ball, running play, which team was in possession)? Where was the foul committed?

10-4-5d isn't a special exception, it just clarifies that for fouls by A or B, the basic spot is the succeeding spot when the foul was committed with B in possession and the play would otherwise result in a touchback.