Return of the video play...

[FeetBallRef]

According to my understanding of the rules, it is a IBB. It just happens that the contact caused #20 to end up in a good spot & he was able to stick out a arm & a tackle just happened to be the result.

I would have thrown the flag. The contact was pretty harsh. If that same contact had happened 10 yards behind the runner, it would have been a PF.

[bcl1127]

Looking at full speed, it was a strong hit in the back, I think that the flag came out correctly. Just because the person gets BIB right into the runner causing the tackle does it mean that is it not a penalty? Nope. Say the runner got by you would bring the ball back to that same spot and march it off from there, so just because the return ended at the point of the penalty does not mean that there should be no flag for something like that, in my opinion.

If you are saying because the illegal block did not "spring the runner" so don't penalize because the play would go back 10 yards, then why would you move the play back ten yards from the spot of the foul if the runner was "sprung". I think that you just need to be consistent. If you think it was a block in the back at that point the penalty should be marked off from that point regardless of if the tackle was made there or not. The end result of the play if the runner got by or not would be placing the ball at the same spot, so really, just because someone commits a penalty and a tackle comes from it the team the foul was committed against is being short changed if you do not throw this flag.

[ajmc]

Are you guys serious? "Here, the block was illegal and at the point of attack. But since the block did not restrict the defender from making a play, don't throw."

Then what the hell are we doing out there? If he hit him with a 2 X 4, but he still made the play, does that excuse everything?

Unless I'm missing something, the blocker took a full 5 step dead aim approach at his opponents back, made contact directly in the back of an opponent who was looking, totally, away from the blocker, and knocked him flying.

I think I've got a pretty good grasp on the concept of "advantage/disadvantage" but anyone letting this one pass because, "the block did not restrict the defender from making a play" should reconsider how he spends his spare time.

[insatty]

With all due respect to the senior official in Refbuz's association, that advice does not reflect the governing philosophy in Division 1 and the NFL. If Division 1 and NFL officials are not calling these fouls, why should HS ball be called differently? The whole idea of governing philosophies is to encourage officiating consistency and proper game management.

With all due respect to ajmc, the bold fonts he uses lead me to believe that he sees this block as worthy of a personal foul. I don't and I would bet that the current Division 1 supervisors would grade a IBW call here as "marginal," meaning that they could defend the call but counsel against it because the governing philosophy requires a restriction. We are not out there to throw flags, but to manage the game to ensure fairness and safety. The emotion that ajmc's post reflects is not an attribute of a football official that desires to move up.

[bcl1127]

Insatty - you talk about safety, how about the kid who gets blocked in the back and because it is from behind and not expecting, falls into the runners legs and rather than tackling the runner, snaps his neck because his head hits his knee.

A block in the back is dangerous at the HS level because the player is not ready for the impact. Say something here happened where the player who was blocked in the back got hurt, everyone would be saying that the flag was justified. Well, it should be justified anytime at this level.

This is not D1 or NFL, these are young kids who should be protected. If something is a foul it is a foul. just because the guy tackled the player by accident does not mean that the team committing the foul should be rewarded (yes rewarded because they are gaining ten yards). If the guy broke loose, the play would come back 10 yard back from the spot...so in reality you are penalizing the guy for MAKING the tackle.

[Welpe]

Originally Posted by insatty

If Division 1 and NFL officials are not calling these fouls, why should HS ball be called differently?

Respectfully, because the game is not the same at the HS and DI levels.

[waltjp]

No flag. No block in the back.

[BoBo]

devils advocate lets say no flag and the kid hits the runner in a weird postion and gets hurt.

now what do we do

[refbuz]

Originally Posted by insatty

With all due respect to the senior official in Refbuz's association, that advice does not reflect the governing philosophy in Division 1 and the NFL. If Division 1 and NFL officials are not calling these fouls, why should HS ball be called differently? The whole idea of governing philosophies is to encourage officiating consistency and proper game management.

I am well aware of game management philosophies.

Would it change you opinion if I told you that the senior official that spoke with works FCS football and his boss assigns games for 8 of the top 25 FCS teams?

[Forksref]

BIB - Flag - Safety issue. Just because he made the tackle doesn't make it a safe play. My judgment is safe vs. unsafe not tackle vs. no tackle. tough time selling a no flag call on an injury.