Timing question

[Moshiner1345]

2nd quarter :12 seconds remaining. 3rd and 4 from the B42 yard line.Team A snaps the ball and goes for a long run (past the first down markers) and is downed on the 2 yard line. The sequence of events are this: player downed, official's whistle is sounded, then mechanical horn goes off from scoreboard indicating the period is over. Bam, Bam, Bam. very sequential.... but very close to one another. As a crew we got together and came to a consensus that the whistle had sounded prior to the mechanical horn sounding. Do you put time on the clock? and if so how much?

According to Rule 3.5.7 The referee shall have the authority to correct obvious errors in timing if discovery is prior to the second live ball following the error, unless the period has officially ended as in 3.3.5

What do you do? and what explanation do you give to coach B

[JugglingReferee]

Originally Posted by Moshiner1345

2nd quarter :12 seconds remaining. 3rd and 4 from the B42 yard line.Team A snaps the ball and goes for a long run (past the first down markers) and is downed on the 2 yard line. The sequence of events are this: player downed, official's whistle is sounded, then mechanical horn goes off from scoreboard indicating the period is over. Bam, Bam, Bam. very sequential.... but very close to one another. As a crew we got together and came to a consensus that the whistle had sounded prior to the mechanical horn sounding. Do you put time on the clock? and if so how much?

According to Rule 3.5.7 The referee shall have the authority to correct obvious errors in timing if discovery is prior to the second live ball following the error, unless the period has officially ended as in 3.3.5

What do you do? and what explanation do you give to coach B

CANADIAN RULING:

Since it's under 3 minutes in either half, the 3-minute warning timing rules kick in, and the clock stops after every play. If there is a discernable difference between the whistle and horn, then yes, a timing error has occured and time should be placed back on the clock, allowing for one more play.

[waltjp]

First off, smack the official for being so quick on the whistle. Secondly, turn off the damn horn.

The horn does not signify the end of the period. There's an expected delay between the whistle and the clock operator's reaction time.

That being said - I'll put 1 second on the clock, set the box and blow the ready for play. I'd also be willing to bet that the mechanical horn will be disconnected next week if it was the home team that gave up the long run.

[Forksref]

Walt nailed it.

Cut the wire to the horn. This is not basketball.

Assuming the down ended inbounds, if I were the A coach I'd call a TO so the clock starts on the snap.

[Ed Hickland]

Originally Posted by Moshiner1345

2nd quarter :12 seconds remaining. 3rd and 4 from the B42 yard line.Team A snaps the ball and goes for a long run (past the first down markers) and is downed on the 2 yard line. The sequence of events are this: player downed, official's whistle is sounded, then mechanical horn goes off from scoreboard indicating the period is over. Bam, Bam, Bam. very sequential.... but very close to one another. As a crew we got together and came to a consensus that the whistle had sounded prior to the mechanical horn sounding. Do you put time on the clock? and if so how much?

According to Rule 3.5.7 The referee shall have the authority to correct obvious errors in timing if discovery is prior to the second live ball following the error, unless the period has officially ended as in 3.3.5

What do you do? and what explanation do you give to coach B

First, as the white hat I would have asked if anybody had a view of the clock and if the clock had time left when the player was downed, not necessarily when the whistle blew. If no one had a view the period would end.

If someone saw the clock and could positively provide the number of seconds remaining on the clock that would be placed on the clock.

My philosophy for putting time on the clock is we must determine that an error had occurred. Without positive confirmation the time stays as is. If there was an error how much time was lost or should be adjusted.

In this situation it sounds like there was a guess time should have not expired but no definitive proof. I would have ended the period.

[Jim D]

I agree with Ed. There is no real evidence that a timing error occurred or, if it did, what the time on the clock should be reset to.

Secondly, a first down is not an automatic clock stopper. After the officials determine that a first down has been made, they signal for an officials time out. That all can take a few seconds so even if there was a delay, there is no timing error. The official's signal is the clock killer, not the end of the play.

[Robert Goodman]

Originally Posted by Ed Hickland

My philosophy for putting time on the clock is we must determine that an error had occurred. Without positive confirmation the time stays as is.

And...what justif'n is there for greater scrutiny of that final second than there was for the time of any preceding clock stoppage?

[Ed Hickland]

Originally Posted by Robert Goodman

And...what justif'n is there for greater scrutiny of that final second than there was for the time of any preceding clock stoppage?

Reminds me of a game two seasons ago. Seven seconds remaining, clock starts on snap. Now I know seven seconds is about the length of the average running play, so, one more run or long pass, the only way to get two plays is a quick pass to the sideline.

QB fades back and starts running in order to give his receivers time to get downfield. He threw the ball and the receiver was unable to catch it as the clock read :00.

According to rule the game is not over until I lift the ball or leave the field. I sought out my LJ who was keeping time and confirmed with him that time had expired as the head coach is yelling in my ear that time should not have expired.

My point being even though the clock read zero I did a check to confirm time had expired.

Now there may have been other times when the scrunity was not as intense, in fact, my rule is if there is a discrepancy less than eight seconds between the game clock and the clock on the field, don't bother with correction. Frequent corrections of the clock question the credibility of the clock operation.