Snap is part of Loose Ball Play???

[Robert Goodman]

Is there any practical significance to this distinction? If the ball is being snapped hand-to-hand, and is transferred successfully, is the point that some foul may occur during the snap (not much opp'ty because the snap must be "quick") such that you'd have to distinguish between enforcement spots?

At one time NFL rules (which treat "pass" differently) defined the snap as a backward pass that puts the ball in play, and defined "pass" as being done by a player in possession of a live ball -- leading to the absurdity that the ball would have to be live before it could be made live.

Robert

[wisref2]

I knew it was in there somewhere!!!

Page 77, Football Penalty

A loose-ball play is action during:

"3. A backward pass (including the snap)......."

Of course, that is also in the rules:

Page 36, Rule 2-33-1: A loose ball play is action during:
c. A backward pass (including the snap).......

I think the Federation puts in questions like that to make us dig into the rule book and find all the little nuances - that's what makes discussions like this so much fun. Though it would be nice if they got the answer correct themselves.

[MJT]

Originally Posted by wisref2

I knew it was in there somewhere!!!

Page 77, Football Penalty

A loose-ball play is action during:

"3. A backward pass (including the snap)......."

Of course, that is also in the rules:

Page 36, Rule 2-33-1: A loose ball play is action during:
c. A backward pass (including the snap).......

I think the Federation puts in questions like that to make us dig into the rule book and find all the little nuances - that's what makes discussions like this so much fun. Though it would be nice if they got the answer correct themselves.

We've all been agreeing that it can be a pass, in shotgun formation, my point is that it is not ALWAYS a pass. If it is a hand to hand snap, it is handed and not passed, and thus a piss poor question!

[The Ref of OZ!!!]

I think the whole point of this discussion, the test question, and the rule is for penalty enforcement. Why else would you consider whether the play is a loose-ball play or not???

I notice that rule 10-4-2 says; The basic spot is the previous spot:
a. For a foul which occurs simultaneously with the snap...... (ie. Loose-ball play)

The snap is classified right along with other loose-ball plays. Finally, I've found a rule that actually makes sense!!!!

JimO.

[BktBallRef]

Originally Posted by MJT

We've all been agreeing that it can be a pass, in shotgun formation, my point is that it is not ALWAYS a pass. If it is a hand to hand snap, it is handed and not passed, and thus a piss poor question!

MJT, I didn't say you were wrong or that your argument didn't make sense. I said the NFHS doesn't agree with you.

It says a backwards pass which includes the snap is part of a loose ball play. So whether we like it or not, or whether we can point to other definitions that are contradictory, the snap is part of a loose ball play.

[Ed Maeder]

In studying the other day just a phrase out of the Redding Study Guide. "Except when the ball is handed directly to the quarterback, a snap is a backward pass." It seems some of us aren't the only ones to feel this way.

[BktBallRef]

Originally Posted by Ed Maeder

In studying the other day just a phrase out of the Redding Study Guide. "Except when the ball is handed directly to the quarterback, a snap is a backward pass." It seems some of us aren't the only ones to feel this way.

The last time I checked, Rogers and George weren't the NFHS.

[Two Call]

2-33-1 A loose-ball play is action during:
c. A backward pass (including the snap), an illegal kick or fumble made by A from in or behind the neutral zone prior to a change of team possession.
10.4.2 Situation B
When any foul occurs during a free kick, scrimmage kick, legal forward pass, backward pass (including the snap) or fumble made by A from in or behind the neutral zone...even if several of these actions happen during the same down...the basic spot remains the same, the previous spot which is the spot of the snap or free kick.