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Old Wed May 12, 2004, 03:09pm
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Talking

I want to take a second and thank you guys and the Official Forum managers for providing a site for us die-hards who’re really serious about learning and improving our officiating skills. Maintaining the proper decorum isn’t really all that hard. But it does seem to take a registration process and a site manager to keep the whackos at bay. Anyway , guesses what I got? Now my Uncle ED has sent me a few quizzes to work on. You see, when he’s not running up and down a NFL sideline he’s keeping himself involved in helping HS football Officials. So while I’m working on the answers to Uncle Ernie’s May quiz I thought maybe you guys would like to check out Uncle Ed’s. I just glanced at some of the case plays and they seem to be pretty strait forward. So lets have some fun and see if we can learn something while we’re at it. Here’s the first one.

Directions: Give the Down/Distance/ Yardline from where the ball will next be snapped.
(ex. A 3/10 A40, clock on snap)
1. A 3/6 A44. A2 takes a handoff and runs to the A45 where he is tackled by B1. During the run, B1 grasped the facemask of the ball carrier and let go. Ruling:_____

2. A 4/10 50. A punts. The punt is caught by B2 on the B20 and run back to the B45. During the run, B3 held on the B23. Ruling:_____

3. A KO from A40. A’s kick is muffed by B2 at the B5 and rolls into the endzone. After the play-A commits a dead ball personal foul against B2. Ruling:_____

4. A 3/2 A 18. A1’s pass is intercepted by B1 and run back to the A17. B2 roughed the QB after the pass. Ruling:____

5. A 4/10 on A22. A2 muffs the snap and runs to the A31. During his run, A5 held B5 at the A23. Ruling:___

6. A 2/7 B10. A2 sweeps around right end for a TD. During the run, A8 held B6 @ the B3. Ruling:_____

7. A 2/13 on A27. A5 runs to the A32 where he fumbles the ball which is recovered by B9 who runs it in for a TD. During A5’s run, A4 clipped on the A30. Ruling:___

8. A 4/6 A37. A’s punt is fielded by B2 on the B 39 and run back to the A45. At the snap, A had only 6 men on the LOS. Ruling:___

9. A 4/6 B26. A7’s FG attempt is blocked by B2 at the B33 and rolls out of bounds at the B27. Ruling:____

10. A 1/10 A20 A2 runs and is tackled for a loss on the A9. After the play is blown dead, B2 piles on. Ruling:

11. A 1/10 A20. A2 runs to the A29 where he is tackled. After the play is blown dead A7 piles on. Ruling:___

12. A 3/3 A47. A2 runs to the A48 where he is downed. A7 held during the run @ the A47. Ruling:___

[Edited by James Neil on May 12th, 2004 at 04:13 PM]
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Old Wed May 12, 2004, 05:11pm
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Are you wanting NCAA or NF rulings?
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Old Thu May 13, 2004, 12:39am
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Canadian Rulings:


1. A 3/6 A44. A2 takes a handoff and runs to the A45 where he is tackled by B1. During the run, B1 grasped the facemask of the ball carrier and let go. Ruling:_____

UR-Facemask. 15 from PBD, PBH, PLS, automatic 1st down. 1A/10 @ B50.

2. A 4/10 50. A punts. The punt is caught by B2 on the B20 and run back to the B45. During the run, B3 held on the B23. Ruling:_____

10 from PBH, 1D/10.

3. A KO from A40. A’s kick is muffed by B2 at the B5 and rolls into the endzone. After the play-A commits a dead ball personal foul against B2. Ruling:_____

This is tough b/c we don't have a touchback rule, so here in Canada, what happens with the ball after it enters the EZ? Regardless, we're going to assess a 15y foul from PBD.

4. A 3/2 A 18. A1’s pass is intercepted by B1 and run back to the A17. B2 roughed the QB after the pass. Ruling:____

UR-Roughing the passer. 15 from PLS, 1D. 1D/10 @ 33.

5. A 4/10 on A22. A2 muffs the snap and runs to the A31. During his run, A5 held B5 at the A23. Ruling:___

L10 PLS = 4D/20 @12 or decline: B 1D/10 @ 31.

6. A 2/7 B10. A2 sweeps around right end for a TD. During the run, A8 held B6 @ the B3. Ruling:_____

L10 PLS = 2/17 @ 10.

7. A 2/13 on A27. A5 runs to the A32 where he fumbles the ball which is recovered by B9 who runs it in for a TD. During A5’s run, A4 clipped on the A30. Ruling:___

B decline for a TD. Accept: HD, PLS = 2/26.5 @ 13.5.

8. A 4/6 A37. A’s punt is fielded by B2 on the B 39 and run back to the A45. At the snap, A had only 6 men on the LOS. Ruling:___

B decline IP, 1D/10 @ 45. Accept: 4D/11 @ 32.

9. A 4/6 B26. A7’s FG attempt is blocked by B2 at the B33 and rolls out of bounds at the B27. Ruling:____

B 1D/10 @ 27.

10. A 1/10 A20 A2 runs and is tackled for a loss on the A9. After the play is blown dead, B2 piles on. Ruling:

UR-Piling On. 15 from PBD, 1st down. 1D/10 @ 24.

11. A 1/10 A20. A2 runs to the A29 where he is tackled. After the play is blown dead A7 piles on. Ruling:___

A piling on? Hmm... I guess in Canada that's just a UR. HD from PBD, DC. A 2D/15.5 @ 14.5.

12. A 3/3 A47. A2 runs to the A48 where he is downed. A7 held during the run @ the A47. Ruling:___

L10, PLS, DR. 3/13 @ 37.
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Old Thu May 13, 2004, 06:55am
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I want to take a second and thank you guys and the Official Forum managers for providing a site for us die-hards who’re really serious about learning and improving our officiating skills. Maintaining the proper decorum isn’t really all that hard. But it does seem to take a registration process and a site manager to keep the whackos at bay. Anyway , guesses what I got? Now my Uncle ED has sent me a few quizzes to work on. You see, when he’s not running up and down a NFL sideline he’s keeping himself involved in helping HS football Officials. So while I’m working on the answers to Uncle Ernie’s May quiz I thought maybe you guys would like to check out Uncle Ed’s. I just glanced at some of the case plays and they seem to be pretty strait forward. So lets have some fun and see if we can learn something while we’re at it. Here’s the first one.

Directions: Give the Down/Distance/ Yardline from where the ball will next be snapped.
(ex. A 3/10 A40, clock on snap)


1. A 3/6 A44. A2 takes a handoff and runs to the A45 where he is tackled by B1. During the run, B1 grasped the facemask of the ball carrier and let go. Ruling:_____


Thought I'd start with the first five. I'm using NF rules, although I may try these with NCAA rules later.



Play is a running play so basic spot is end of run. Foul is by defense so we enforce a 5-yard facemask penalty from the basic spot. Penalty takes the ball to/past the line-to-gain so A's ball 1/10 at the A-50, clock on the RFP.

2. A 4/10 50. A punts. The punt is caught by B2 on the B20 and run back to the B45. During the run, B3 held on the B23. Ruling:_____

Play meets all of the PSK criteria so basic spot is the end of the kick. Foul is by offense in advance of the basic spot so we enforce from the end of the kick. B's ball 1/10 at B-10, clock on the snap.

3. A KO from A40. A’s kick is muffed by B2 at the B5 and rolls into the endzone. After the play-A commits a dead ball personal foul against B2. Ruling:_____

Play results in a touchback once it breaks the plane of B's goal line. Enforce the dead ball PF from the succeeding spot (B's 20). 1/10 for B from B-35, clock on the snap.


4. A 3/2 A 18. A1’s pass is intercepted by B1 and run back to the A17. B2 roughed the QB after the pass. Ruling:____

Play is a loose-ball play. B did not get the ball with clean hands. Basic spot is previous spot.A's ball 1/10 from the A-9 and automatic first down, clock on the RFP if B1 was tackled inbounds.

5. A 4/10 on A22. A2 muffs the snap and runs to the A31. During his run, A5 held B5 at the A23. Ruling:___

Play is a running play. Basic spot is end of run. B will want to decline the penalty and get the ball 1/10 from the A-31 (clock on the snap). If they accept, it will be A's ball 4/19 from the A-13, clock on the RFP.

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Old Thu May 13, 2004, 11:52am
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REPLY: Hey Jim...just how many uncles do you have??

Really, someday you need to get to the NY/NJ area so that you, Uncle Ed, and I can go out for dinner and talk about football. And bring "dkl" along!
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Old Thu May 13, 2004, 01:18pm
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Quote:
Originally posted by mikesears
2. A 4/10 50. A punts. The punt is caught by B2 on the B20 and run back to the B45. During the run, B3 held on the B23. Ruling:_____

Play meets all of the PSK criteria so basic spot is the end of the kick. Foul is by offense in advance of the basic spot so we enforce from the end of the kick. B's ball 1/10 at B-10, clock on the snap.


[/B]
Mike Does this meet the requirements for PSK?
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Old Thu May 13, 2004, 03:43pm
JMN JMN is offline
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Quote:
Originally posted by mikesears


2. A 4/10 50. A punts. The punt is caught by B2 on the B20 and run back to the B45. During the run, B3 held on the B23. Ruling:_____

Play meets all of the PSK criteria so basic spot is the end of the kick. Foul is by offense in advance of the basic spot so we enforce from the end of the kick. B's ball 1/10 at B-10, clock on the snap.

>>>>>> Since the foul occurred during the run (the kick had ended with B's possession), I think the PSK window has closed, thus no PSK enforcement. Therefore, the basic spot is the B-23 since the foul occurred behind the end of the run. B 1/0 @ B-13 snap.

4. A 3/2 A 18. A1’s pass is intercepted by B1 and run back to the A17. B2 roughed the QB after the pass. Ruling:____

Play is a loose-ball play. B did not get the ball with clean hands. Basic spot is previous spot.A's ball 1/10 from the A-9 and automatic first down, clock on the RFP if B1 was tackled inbounds.

>>>>>>> Mike, you nailed it, just went the wrong way . The basic spot is the previous spot (A-18) and we tack on 15 yds for the roughing foul and the auto 1st.
Result is A 1/10 @ A-33



[/B]
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Old Thu May 13, 2004, 05:14pm
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Quote:
Originally posted by James Neil
1. A 3/6 A44. A2 takes a handoff and runs to the A45 where he is tackled by B1. During the run, B1 grasped the facemask of the ball carrier and let go. Ruling:_____

2. A 4/10 50. A punts. The punt is caught by B2 on the B20 and run back to the B45. During the run, B3 held on the B23. Ruling:_____

3. A KO from A40. A’s kick is muffed by B2 at the B5 and rolls into the endzone. After the play-A commits a dead ball personal foul against B2. Ruling:_____

4. A 3/2 A 18. A1’s pass is intercepted by B1 and run back to the A17. B2 roughed the QB after the pass. Ruling:____

5. A 4/10 on A22. A2 muffs the snap and runs to the A31. During his run, A5 held B5 at the A23. Ruling:___

6. A 2/7 B10. A2 sweeps around right end for a TD. During the run, A8 held B6 @ the B3. Ruling:_____

7. A 2/13 on A27. A5 runs to the A32 where he fumbles the ball which is recovered by B9 who runs it in for a TD. During A5’s run, A4 clipped on the A30. Ruling:___

8. A 4/6 A37. A’s punt is fielded by B2 on the B 39 and run back to the A45. At the snap, A had only 6 men on the LOS. Ruling:___

9. A 4/6 B26. A7’s FG attempt is blocked by B2 at the B33 and rolls out of bounds at the B27. Ruling:____

10. A 1/10 A20 A2 runs and is tackled for a loss on the A9. After the play is blown dead, B2 piles on. Ruling:

11. A 1/10 A20. A2 runs to the A29 where he is tackled. After the play is blown dead A7 piles on. Ruling:___

12. A 3/3 A47. A2 runs to the A48 where he is downed. A7 held during the run @ the A47. Ruling:___

[Edited by James Neil on May 12th, 2004 at 04:13 PM]
NCAA
1. A 1/10 50. Ready.
2. B 1/10 B13. Snap.
3. B 1/10 B35. Snap. (assuming that the ball somehow became dead when it went into the endzone (i.e. ball rolled through the endzone)
4. A 1/10 A33. Snap.
5. B 1/10 A31. Snap. Decline Hold.
6. A 2/10 B13. Snap.
7. B TRY 1.5 or B K/O from the 50.
8. A 4/11 A32 or B 1/10 A45. Snap either way.
9. B 1/10 B27. Snap.
10. A 1/10 A24. Ready.
11. A 2/15.5 A14.5. Ready.
12. A 3/14 A36. Ready. (this could also be A 4/2 A48, ready, if B declines the penalty. I think both options need to be given here)

Let the flames begin!
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Old Thu May 13, 2004, 05:32pm
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Quote:
Originally posted by Bob M.
REPLY: Hey Jim...just how many uncles do you have??

Really, someday you need to get to the NY/NJ area so that you, Uncle Ed, and I can go out for dinner and talk about football. And bring "dkl" along!
You know something Cuzz , I got more Uncles then a monkey. I’ll check with Big Daddy DKL and see if he’s wants to head on over for a big family reunion

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Old Fri May 14, 2004, 12:03pm
JMN JMN is offline
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[QUOTE]Lin-Jdg
12. A 3/14 A36. Ready. (this could also be A 4/2 A48, ready, if B declines the penalty. I think both options need to be given here)

Let the flames begin!

>>>>>>> Lin-Jdg, good job.

My only addition would be that on #12, the basic spot would be the A47 as the spot of the foul was behind the end of the run. So, A 3/13 @ A37; ready.
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Old Mon May 17, 2004, 06:39am
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Quote:
Originally posted by Jim S
Quote:
Originally posted by mikesears
2. A 4/10 50. A punts. The punt is caught by B2 on the B20 and run back to the B45. During the run, B3 held on the B23. Ruling:_____

Play meets all of the PSK criteria so basic spot is the end of the kick. Foul is by offense in advance of the basic spot so we enforce from the end of the kick. B's ball 1/10 at B-10, clock on the snap.

Mike Does this meet the requirements for PSK? [/B]
OOPS! You are right. It DOESN'T meet PSK requirements because the ball was in POSSESSION at the time of the foul (making this a running play). Thanks for correcting me.
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Old Mon May 17, 2004, 06:41am
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Quote:
Originally posted by JMN
Quote:
Originally posted by mikesears


2. A 4/10 50. A punts. The punt is caught by B2 on the B20 and run back to the B45. During the run, B3 held on the B23. Ruling:_____

Play meets all of the PSK criteria so basic spot is the end of the kick. Foul is by offense in advance of the basic spot so we enforce from the end of the kick. B's ball 1/10 at B-10, clock on the snap.

>>>>>> Since the foul occurred during the run (the kick had ended with B's possession), I think the PSK window has closed, thus no PSK enforcement. Therefore, the basic spot is the B-23 since the foul occurred behind the end of the run. B 1/0 @ B-13 snap.

4. A 3/2 A 18. A1’s pass is intercepted by B1 and run back to the A17. B2 roughed the QB after the pass. Ruling:____

Play is a loose-ball play. B did not get the ball with clean hands. Basic spot is previous spot.A's ball 1/10 from the A-9 and automatic first down, clock on the RFP if B1 was tackled inbounds.

>>>>>>> Mike, you nailed it, just went the wrong way . The basic spot is the previous spot (A-18) and we tack on 15 yds for the roughing foul and the auto 1st.
Result is A 1/10 @ A-33


[/B]

This is why I love umpires. They won't let the penalty get marched off in the wrong direction

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Old Mon May 17, 2004, 01:17pm
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Quote:
Originally posted by mikesears


OOPS! You are right. It DOESN'T meet PSK requirements because the ball was in POSSESSION at the time of the foul (making this a running play). Thanks for correcting me.
REPLY: Don't fret Mike...This is the type of play that you could easily miss on a test, but will most likely enforce correctly on the field.
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