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  #16 (permalink)  
Old Tue Jan 10, 2017, 03:53pm
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Robert Goodman View Post
What does "mechanical hole" mean? That the officials' mechanics are such as to make it too difficult a call? Gap in coverage? Even with as many officials as they have?

Try it in the games I'm used to, with 3-official crews. The only saving grace there is that there's not much passing in most divisions. The past couple seasons in the Warriors they were doing it on scrimmage plays w U & L on the wings, R in the O backfield.
Hire a 4th official. Even 4th grade games here are played with 4 now.
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  #17 (permalink)  
Old Tue Jan 10, 2017, 04:15pm
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Rich View Post
Hire a 4th official. Even 4th grade games here are played with 4 now.
Heck hire 5 if it is "all about the kids." Then you have everything covered and not much ambiguousness at that level.

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  #18 (permalink)  
Old Tue Jan 10, 2017, 04:41pm
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7.3.8.b says it is the responsibility of the offensive player to avoid contact.


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Last edited by bigjohn; Tue Jan 10, 2017 at 04:46pm.
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  #19 (permalink)  
Old Tue Jan 10, 2017, 04:50pm
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Hard to tell if he avoids it when the defender initiates it and pulls the receiver to the ground.
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  #20 (permalink)  
Old Tue Jan 10, 2017, 05:03pm
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Originally Posted by Rich View Post
Hard to tell if he avoids it when the defender initiates it and pulls the receiver to the ground.
Yep.

And if I have to guess, I am not making that call.

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  #21 (permalink)  
Old Tue Jan 10, 2017, 05:23pm
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If anything, this is a foul on the defense for initiating contact. Definitely not OPI. As for the earlier Clemson TD at the start of the 4th quarter, that was OPI.

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  #22 (permalink)  
Old Tue Jan 10, 2017, 05:44pm
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What if then if the defender, upon contact by the offensive player, instead of engaging backed off after the initial contact? Would a flag be justified then?

In the photo posted by bigjohn, the DB's eyes appear to be focused on #13 and that makes me think he had no intention to engage the wide receiver.

Last edited by 9thIsleZebra; Tue Jan 10, 2017 at 06:09pm.
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  #23 (permalink)  
Old Wed Jan 11, 2017, 09:55am
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Originally Posted by Rich View Post
Hire a 4th official. Even 4th grade games here are played with 4 now.
Sure, with the rich kids.

But I'd still like to know what MD Longhorn meant by "mechanical hole".

Last edited by Robert Goodman; Wed Jan 11, 2017 at 09:58am.
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  #24 (permalink)  
Old Wed Jan 11, 2017, 10:55am
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Originally Posted by 9thIsleZebra View Post
What if then if the defender, upon contact by the offensive player, instead of engaging backed off after the initial contact? Would a flag be justified then?

In the photo posted by bigjohn, the DB's eyes appear to be focused on #13 and that makes me think he had no intention to engage the wide receiver.
A picture may say 1000 words, but a video shows 1000 pictures. Watch this whole sequence ... this photo is misleading.
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  #25 (permalink)  
Old Wed Jan 11, 2017, 01:29pm
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https://youtu.be/czDFgvjtt4I

Here is the video, I don't see A avoiding contact.
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  #26 (permalink)  
Old Wed Jan 11, 2017, 01:56pm
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Originally Posted by bigjohn View Post
https://youtu.be/czDFgvjtt4I

Here is the video, I don't see A avoiding contact.
He is not supposed to avoid contact. He is allowed to run his route. The defender bit on the route and engaged that player.

I work deep wing in college and if I see that, then I am not calling any foul on that if that is my key or my area. Because when you have players up on coverage, they often bite on moves and that was the reason the inside guy was up. It was the coverage as well. Sorry, I doubt we will ever see anyone complain about this play from the NCAA because they would have to advocate many more fouls. That is why many defenses call a zone coverage at that part of the field. You make the wrong move, you leave someone open. The defender took on the guy on the inside.

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  #27 (permalink)  
Old Wed Jan 11, 2017, 02:03pm
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And I can say from my years as a college deep wing they don't advocate throwing a lot of marginal flags. When in doubt, the flag stays in the belt.
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  #28 (permalink)  
Old Wed Jan 11, 2017, 02:16pm
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Illegal Contact and Pass Interference
ARTICLE 8. a. During a down in which a legal forward pass crosses the
neutral zone, illegal contact by Team A and Team B players is prohibited
from the time the ball is snapped until it is touched by any player or an
official (A.R. 7-3-8-II).
b. Offensive pass interference by a Team A player beyond the neutral zone
during a legal forward pass play in which a forward pass crosses the
neutral zone is contact that interferes with a Team B eligible player. It
is the responsibility of the offensive player to avoid the opponents
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  #29 (permalink)  
Old Wed Jan 11, 2017, 02:51pm
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You can post it in big letters all you like. You would never survive at the college level if that is what you would call.

BTW, what "category" do you put this in? If you do not know what I am talking about, then you do not anything about this application of the rule?

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  #30 (permalink)  
Old Wed Jan 11, 2017, 02:59pm
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There are four classifications of OPI: 1) blocking downfield (or pick plays), 2) shoving or pushing off, 3) driving through a defender, and 4) the receiver turning into a defender.


http://www.nkoafootball.org/smembers...g/hardcall.doc


I think it is pretty obvious the Offense initiated the contact. That is my opinion.
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Last edited by bigjohn; Wed Jan 11, 2017 at 03:02pm.
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