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Old Sat Sep 10, 2016, 03:46pm
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OSU-Central Michigan finish

Was listening on the radio, so I may not have all the specifics 100% accurate, but the pertinent info is good. With 8 seconds left on the game clock in the 4th quarter, facing 4th down with a 3 point lead, OSU decided to try run out the clock by having the QB take the snap and throw the pass high and way out of bounds to allow the clock to run out. The problem was that the QB was still in the pocket and there was no receiver even close to the area. The clock did expire during the pass, but intentional grounding was called and Central Michigan was given an untimed down due to the penalty.

I'm pretty sure the enforcement was correct but I can't find the rules support. Any help?
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Old Sat Sep 10, 2016, 03:54pm
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It was incorrect. Loss of down foul means no untimed down. Conference has already acknowledged the error.
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Old Sat Sep 10, 2016, 04:22pm
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Originally Posted by BoomerSooner View Post
Was listening on the radio, so I may not have all the specifics 100% accurate, but the pertinent info is good. With 8 seconds left on the game clock in the 4th quarter, facing 4th down with a 3 point lead, OSU decided to try run out the clock by having the QB take the snap and throw the pass high and way out of bounds to allow the clock to run out. The problem was that the QB was still in the pocket and there was no receiver even close to the area. The clock did expire during the pass, but intentional grounding was called and Central Michigan was given an untimed down due to the penalty.

I'm pretty sure the enforcement was correct but I can't find the rules support. Any help?
There were only 4 seconds left when the last down was snapped.
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Old Sat Sep 10, 2016, 04:29pm
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Old Sat Sep 10, 2016, 04:34pm
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Soccer guy chiming in with a probably-dumb question:

The rule says there is an untimed down unless the foul is on the "team in possession." Since it was 4th down, the play ended with a change of possession. Does the phrase "team in possession" refer to the team possessing the ball at the end of the play (as in, the defense intercepts the pass and the returner gets tackled by the face mask on his way to the end zone) or does it only refer to who is in possession at the snap?

Or, am I misunderstanding something about when and how possession changes after 4th down?

Thanks.
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Old Sat Sep 10, 2016, 05:33pm
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Possession at the time of the foul.
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Old Sat Sep 10, 2016, 08:08pm
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I know why the officials missed it: since the foul was on OkSU, it was 4th down, and the time ran out, there wasn't really a penalty for the foul. Which is odd and probably threw off their thinking. I can't prove that I wouldn't have missed that as well.

They clearly missed this, but I'm wondering: shouldn't the rule be revised? Had this been called correctly, OkSU would have gained a huge advantage -- foul on the last play for which there was no penalty. So go ahead and commit a foul as long as it includes a LOD provision. I would suggest a rules change that says the untimed down will take place if the accepted penalty results in a change of possession.
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Old Sat Sep 10, 2016, 09:06pm
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I'm wondering how the MAC is officiating a Big 12 home game? Doesn't the home conference cover the contest?
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Old Sat Sep 10, 2016, 09:27pm
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So, to my knowledge, no conference has ever done this, and I'm not sure that even here it would be a good idea, but...

The outcome of the game was demonstrably changed by a misapplication of a rule. There is no question about what would have happened if it had been called correctly. If ever there was a time for a conference to overturn a game result, this would be it.

Any chance this happens?
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Old Sat Sep 10, 2016, 09:41pm
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I'm wondering how the MAC is officiating a Big 12 home game? Doesn't the home conference cover the contest?
There is no across the board policy. Often the visiting team brings in a crew, but some crews like the Pac-12 do not allow any other crews to come on their fields (at least that has been their policy for some time). Usually the teams not in the Power 5 are allowed to bring their crews in a visiting game. Now that being said, the MAC is apart of the consortium that involves the BIG and the Missouri Valley.

I am sure this entire situation will be talked about at our meeting on Tuesday. I am just wondering are any of the officials on this game from my area?

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Old Sat Sep 10, 2016, 11:09pm
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how the MAC is officiating a Big 12 home game
Non conference games are covered by the contract between schools. Sometimes, the visiting team's conference covers them, sometimes the home team's and other times they get them from a third conference. A Big 12 crew worked Houston vs. OU and a Pac 12 crew worked UCLA vs. A&M last week -- both road teams' conferences were at the game. Houston and College Station are an hour and a half apart and the crews should have just switched games.

I think the NCAA should require the third conference option.
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Old Sun Sep 11, 2016, 03:08am
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Side guy got in the way of the deep guy. Mechanics flub as well as a rules flub.

Having said that, the offense deliberately commited a foul and benefitted from it in the most perfect way - winning the game. Logic dictates that the non-offending team should be given something, and if that something is one untimed down where they win on a Hail Mary/lateral, then so be it.
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Old Sun Sep 11, 2016, 03:10am
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Old Sun Sep 11, 2016, 08:17am
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Was this even IG? Wasn't done to conserve time or avoid loss of yardage.
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Old Sun Sep 11, 2016, 09:00am
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Originally Posted by Texas Aggie View Post
I know why the officials missed it: since the foul was on OkSU, it was 4th down, and the time ran out, there wasn't really a penalty for the foul. Which is odd and probably threw off their thinking. I can't prove that I wouldn't have missed that as well.

They clearly missed this, but I'm wondering: shouldn't the rule be revised? Had this been called correctly, OkSU would have gained a huge advantage -- foul on the last play for which there was no penalty. So go ahead and commit a foul as long as it includes a LOD provision. I would suggest a rules change that says the untimed down will take place if the accepted penalty results in a change of possession.
Doesn't that seem disproportionate to you?

What does making a pass incomplete do? It can prevent loss of yardage, or it can stop loss of time. What is an untimed down for the other team supposed to be in compensation for?
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