Foul Ruling?

[Hawkeyes]

Originally Posted by Maineac

This was not my play and I was not there to witness it. This is how it was described to me by an official who was there. A1, attempting a 3 point FG from the wing, is fouled in the act of shooting by B1. As A1 falls to the floor, he grabs the arm of B1 and pulls B1 down on top of himself. This grabbing and pulling of B1 was not judged to be accidental. I'm interested to see how this play would be ruled by forum members.

6.7.4 doesn't matter if intentional or unintentional...

False Double foul. Doesn't matter if the ball goes in or not. Second foul by A1 was a player control and caused ball to become dead. Wipe the basket anyway! A1 gets 3 throws, with lane space cleared; because the ball goes to POI and is awarded to Team B.

[Adam]

Originally Posted by Hawkeyes

6.7.4 doesn't matter if intentional or unintentional...

Double foul indeed! Doesn't matter if the ball goes in or not. Second foul by A1 was a player control and caused ball to become dead. Wipe the basket anyway! A1 gets 3 throws, with lane space cleared; because the ball goes to POI and is awarded to Team B.

If it's a double foul, then it's not a player control. Basket counts, no free throws.

POI depends on whether the basket goes in. If it does, B gets the ball for an end line throw in. If it does not go in, you go to the arrow at the spot nearest the double foul.

10-6 penalty 1c, "No free throws: for double personal or technical fouls (point of interruption).

[Hawkeyes]

I'm sorry - this is a false double foul (4-11; 4-19-6; 4-19-9)
I stand corrected - good catch.

[Adam]

Originally Posted by Hawkeyes

I'm sorry - this is a false double foul (4-11; 4-19-6; 4-19-9)
I stand corrected - good catch.

I actually think it's a double foul, as they are "at approximately the same time."

I don't think this is all that clear cut, though, so I know a few are going to get a different answer.

[Camron Rust]

Originally Posted by Hawkeyes

I'm sorry - this is a false double foul (4-11; 4-19-6; 4-19-9)
I stand corrected - good catch.

No need. I think it could be ruled either a double or a false double as "approximately" is rather vague. It really depends. I could argue either one.

[Nevadaref]

Originally Posted by Hawkeyes

6.7.4 doesn't matter if intentional or unintentional...

False Double foul. Doesn't matter if the ball goes in or not. Second foul by A1 was a player control and caused ball to become dead. Wipe the basket anyway! A1 gets 3 throws, with lane space cleared; because the ball goes to POI and is awarded to Team B.

If you decide to rule this a false double foul instead of just a double foul, the shooter's foul still would not be a PC foul as we have been informed that the player returned to the floor before fouling his opponent. Therefore, he is no longer an airborne shooter.

[Hawkeyes]

"Returned to the floor" is open to interpretation isn't it? What if a player shoots a set shot (not leaving the floor at all)?
If "airborne shooter" really only applied to literally being in the air - most girls below the collegiate level wouldn't get many FT's for "jump shots" on that dreaded illegal block-out.
Unless we are forced to go to a monitor in high school - that foul by the shooter seems to create the very confusing false double foul:
Live ball, fouls by both teams, before the clock is started following the first.

[BillyMac]

Originally Posted by Hawkeyes

"Returned to the floor" is open to interpretation isn't it? What if a player shoots a set shot (not leaving the floor at all)?

Still a shooter, just not an airborne shooter.

[Camron Rust]

Originally Posted by Hawkeyes

"Returned to the floor" is open to interpretation isn't it? What if a player shoots a set shot (not leaving the floor at all)?
If "airborne shooter" really only applied to literally being in the air - most girls below the collegiate level wouldn't get many FT's for "jump shots" on that dreaded illegal block-out.
Unless we are forced to go to a monitor in high school - that foul by the shooter seems to create the very confusing false double foul:
Live ball, fouls by both teams, before the clock is started following the first.

Once the shot is released and the player is on the floor, the shooter is no longer a shooter. If it is a set shot, they cease to be a shooter on the release. Can't be an "airborne" shooter if not airborne.

[Nevadaref]

Originally Posted by Hawkeyes

"Returned to the floor" is open to interpretation isn't it? What if a player shoots a set shot (not leaving the floor at all)?
If "airborne shooter" really only applied to literally being in the air - most girls below the collegiate level wouldn't get many FT's for "jump shots" on that dreaded illegal block-out.
Unless we are forced to go to a monitor in high school - that foul by the shooter seems to create the very confusing false double foul:
Live ball, fouls by both teams, before the clock is started following the first.

Didn't we just have a long thread on this in which another poster had difficulty grasping that once an airborne shooter touches the floor the act of shooting is over and any foul is not a shooting foul? I believe that he also inquired about a set shot and was quoted the rule stating that the act of shooting ends when the try is clearly in flight (if no airborne shooter is involved).
I'll direct you to that thread for more info.