POE announcer question

[Rich1]

Originally Posted by BryanV21

The way I read it is the announcer can not say anything during a live ball. Whether that's who scored, who was fouled, etc. He/She can ONLY talk when the ball is dead.

Technically the announcer is allowed to announce who scored but since he can only do so in that short amount of time while the ball is dead between the ball going through the hoop and the start of the ensuing throw in he better spit it out fast. Plus, if all he can say is "Bill Jones", "James Monroe", or "Lefty Twofoots" I doubt it will be that cool so few will want to do it.

Announcers around here aren't too bad but there are a few schools that were headed in the direction of going too far. I can forsee an announcer trying to argue that the rules permit him to announce the name of who scored if they don't understand when the ball becomes live after a made basket.

At our last meeting we were encouraged to visit with the announcer as part of our pregame with the table. I'm thinking about printing out tiny little copies of the rule & POE just in case someone needs a reminder.

[OKREF]

We've been told that basically the rule was to stop the announcer from doing a play by play call like you would hear on the radio. No running commentary during the game.

[bob jenkins]

imo, it would be nice if the states (at least IL) decided to interpet it / enforce it that way -- but that's not what the rule says

[Freddy]

Am striving around here to propose the shift of this idiocy from officials' responsibility to where it belongs, the responsibility of the AD's and/or game administrators.
This ought not be an officials' issue. Next things they'll have us enforce: concession stand health standards, the Pantone shading of the color of pens the scorekeepers use, and the grains of hardness of the water coming out of the locker room showers.
What the heck is the NFHS thinkin'?
Had this really been a problem in the area of the country where you officiate?

[BillyMac]

Originally Posted by Freddy

Had this really been a problem in the area of the country where you officiate?

Only once, and we, as officials had to handle it:

Game Announcers ...

In my mind, I'm pleased that the NFHS has given us rule backing to stop this kind of behavior.

[OKREF]

Originally Posted by Freddy

Am striving around here to propose the shift of this idiocy from officials' responsibility to where it belongs, the responsibility of the AD's and/or game administrators.
This ought not be an officials' issue. Next things they'll have us enforce: concession stand health standards, the Pantone shading of the color of pens the scorekeepers use, and the grains of hardness of the water coming out of the locker room showers.
What the heck is the NFHS thinkin'?
Had this really been a problem in the area of the country where you officiate?

There isn't even a penalty for any issue with the announcer. We were instructed last year when this came out, that any problem we have with an announcer, we should continue the game and notify our state director and they would handle it.

[Rich1]

Originally Posted by Freddy

Am striving around here to propose the shift of this idiocy from officials' responsibility to where it belongs, the responsibility of the AD's and/or game administrators.
This ought not be an officials' issue.

In a perfect world that would be great. But since the announcer, music, sound effects, etc. could affect the other teams ability to fairly play ball and since there are many administrators who would do nothing (out of fear, incompetence, or collusion) then unfortunately it falls on us as the only impartial arbitrators of the game.

However, we would rarely have to enforce any of these "tangient" rules (uniforms, fans, announcers) if NFHS and state orgs would make the penalty harsh enough to really bite and then insist we enforce them that way. In my board, we are "discouraged" from penalizing the team with a tech or forfeit for the behaviors of those not with the team but I'll bet if we strictly enforced one warning, one tech, and then forfiet the game if the responsible team/admin did not get it under control it wouldn't be our problem for long.

And, while I do follow my boards thinking to a degree (have never had to give a tech or forfieted a game for these) I get REALLY grumpy if a team makes me have to deal with such issues. Leashes get shorter and trigger fingers get a lot more sensitive.

[PIAA REF]

Originally Posted by Rich1

Technically the announcer is allowed to announce who scored but since he can only do so in that short amount of time while the ball is dead between the ball going through the hoop and the start of the ensuing throw in he better spit it out fast. Plus, if all he can say is "Bill Jones", "James Monroe", or "Lefty Twofoots" I doubt it will be that cool so few will want to do it.

Announcers around here aren't too bad but there are a few schools that were headed in the direction of going too far. I can forsee an announcer trying to argue that the rules permit him to announce the name of who scored if they don't understand when the ball becomes live after a made basket.

At our last meeting we were encouraged to visit with the announcer as part of our pregame with the table. I'm thinking about printing out tiny little copies of the rule & POE just in case someone needs a reminder.

I don't think that they are allowed to announce after a made bucket because the clock is still running. this is what is on the pdf from NFHS

The announcer shall be prohibited from making an announcement while the clock is running and while the clock is stopped and the ball is alive…such as during a free throw, a throw in, etc. Doing so could potentially affect communication of coaches, players or be disconcerting

So if I am understanding this they can not announce who scored after a made bucket because the clock is running, correct?

[JetMetFan]

I would hope it means what was mentioned earlier: They can't do play-by-play as though the game is an And1 mix tape (and yes, I ran into this situation in a BV game 2-3 seasons ago). I would hope the rule allows announcers to say who scored and whether it's a 2 or a 3. In other words, what we hear when we go to pro or college games.

I would also hope when they say "announcements while the clock is running" or when the clock is stopped and the ball is live the goal is to eliminate cheering, leading chants of "defense" or just saying something like, "You can buy 50-50 tickets at the concession stand."

[BryanV21]

Unless an assignor or supervisor says otherwise, I don't see myself making a fuss over what the announcer says.

If an announcer says "John Smith with the three" I'm going to let it go. However, if it's more like "John Smith with the THREEEEEEE" then I'll probably let the head coach know that the announcer is flirting with an unsportsmanlike penalty by not following this year's new rule regarding announcements. Chances are that coach will make sure it's taken care of for us. Just like if one of his assistant coaches is getting out of hand.

Basically, just don't do or say something that can be deemed disrespectful or interfering with the game.

[Bad Zebra]

Originally Posted by BryanV21

... I'll probably let the head coach know that the announcer is flirting with an unsportsmanlike penalty by not following this year's new rule regarding announcements...

What's your rule basis for that? Who is going to be penalized? Home team coach? Administrative T? What if it's a holiday tournament? Slippery slope there.

[BryanV21]

Originally Posted by Bad Zebra

What's your rule basis for that? Who is going to be penalized? Home team coach? Administrative T? What if it's a holiday tournament? Slippery slope there.

Rule 2.8.1
Penalize unsporting conduct by any player, coach, substitute, team attendant or follower.

As for the penalty I'd cite Rule 10.4.1.f which states that a bench technical would be called for "inciting undesirable crowd reactions." Or there's 10.4.1.d which states a bench tech would be called for "disrespectfully addressing, baiting or taunting an opponent."

[Bad Zebra]

Originally Posted by BryanV21

Rule 2.8.1
Penalize unsporting conduct by any player, coach, substitute, team attendant or follower.

As for the penalty I'd cite Rule 10.4.1.f which states that a bench technical would be called for "inciting undesirable crowd reactions." Or there's 10.4.1.d which states a bench tech would be called for "disrespectfully addressing, baiting or taunting an opponent."

Both of those are a BIG reach. IN 10-4-1F...The announcer isn't the crowd...and that rule is more intended for the coach's actions....10-4-1D: announcing isn't really addressing the opponent.

I'd be more apt to have the announcer removed...only AFTER addressing it with game admin. and having them try to correct it. Penalizing a team by handing out T's here isn't supported by rule.

[OKREF]

Why the sudden outrage on announcers. This was a new rule for the 2013-14 season. It's just been made a POE for this year, and you will find no penalty for this.

[Rich1]

Rule 1-18 only says that the announcer is profibited from making announcements during the game. It makes no mention of dead balls, half time, time outs, etc. It is quite vague. The POE on the other hand is much more detailed. The POE does say the announcer may say who scored which seems to be in conflict with the "stopped clock" requirement since it makes no sense to announce who scored several minutes after it happens so I would expect it to happen right after the basket. Its a dead ball but the clock is running so it seems muddled. But, as I said earlier, even if allowed I don't see how there would be enough time to do so. I am more than comfortable going with no announcement at all in this case.

The announcer is not part of the table crew (only the scorer and timer are mentioned as such) so I feel you could be justified including the announcer as a fan/follower. In addition, casebook play 1.18 indicates that a scoreboard operator who is acting unsportingly can be penalized with a T so I don't see why that doesn't also apply to an announcer (especially since the scoreboard operator is probably also the official timer).

In practice, if I get no where with the announcer after a polite reminder of the POE then I can stand in front of the table and the game can wait until the announcer is replaced. I am sure the game administrator's patience will run out before mine will.