2014 Unannounced Changes? (e.g. Casebook 4.14.1 Sit. D)

[Mark T. DeNucci, Sr.]

Originally Posted by BillyMac

Nice citation Mark T, DeNucci.

In theory I agree with you, but I've always viewed specific casebook plays as "trumping" anything generic in the rulebook. It appears that the fact that the coach was not notified and that the "five foul player" made some free throws is now considered to be a correctable error.

But not with the CB Play cannot be defended by rule.

MTD, Sr.

[BillyMac]

Originally Posted by Mark T. DeNucci, Sr.

But not with the CB Play cannot be defended by rule.

I'm on my way to work, so I don't have time to think of one, and I can't think of one off the top of my head, but aren't there a few casebook plays that are "free standing" and have no rule backing, or may actually "go against the grain" of a written rule?

[bob jenkins]

Originally Posted by APG

Thoughts on this new casebook play?

iirc, NFHS had this one way, and NCAA (at least W) had it the other. I'm glad they decided to make them the same, but they changed the wrong one.

[scrounge]

As an FYI, it's also available in Kindle form for $5.99....

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[Mark T. DeNucci, Sr.]

Originally Posted by bob jenkins

iirc, NFHS had this one way, and NCAA (at least W) had it the other. I'm glad they decided to make them the same, but they changed the wrong one.

Since I retired from college officiating after the 2007-08 season my interest in the college (men's and women's) is to the extent that I buy copies of the rules, casebooks, and CCA manuals, and only skim through them. When did the NCAA Women's make this change?

MTD, Sr.

[bob jenkins]

Originally Posted by Mark T. DeNucci, Sr.

Since I retired from college officiating after the 2007-08 season my interest in the college (men's and women's) is to the extent that I buy copies of the rules, casebooks, and CCA manuals, and only skim through them. When did the NCAA Women's make this change?

MTD, Sr.

Oh, about 10 years ago (I don't know that it was a change)

[JetMetFan]

For those who are interested, this is the (edited) NCAAW case play for the NFHS situation detailed above:

A.R. 65. A5 is fouled during an unsuccessful try for goal. As A5 goes to the free-throw line, A5 is assessed an unsportsmanlike technical foul, which is A5’s fifth and disqualifying foul. The scorer...does not inform the official that A5 has been disqualified until after A5 attempts the free throws.

RULING: Since A5 and A5’s coach were not notified of the disqualification until after A5’s free throws, the result of A5’s free throws shall stand. (Rule 4-12.4, 8-3.2.c, 2-9.4 and 4-27.1.e)

[Mark T. DeNucci, Sr.]

Originally Posted by bob jenkins

Oh, about 10 years ago (I don't know that it was a change)

Bob:

You mean you don't want to climb in my attic with me and go through 43 years of H.S. and college rules books and casebooks with me.

MTD, Sr.

[Raymond]

Originally Posted by APG

Thoughts on this new casebook play?

*4.14.1 SITUATION D:

A1 is fouled by B1 while Team A is in double bonus. In frustration, A1 pushes B1 after the ball becomes dead. A1 is assessed a technical foul. A1 successfully makes both free throws for the personal foul assessed to B1. B3 is ready to attempt the free throw for the technical foul by A1. The official scorer notifies the officials that the technical foul on A1 was his/her fifth.

RULING: Officials notify the Team A coach and A1 of the disqualification and allow a substitute for A1. A correctable error has occurred by allowing the wrong player (A1) to attempt the free throws for the personal foul and has been discovered within the timeframe to correct. The free throws by A1 are cancelled and A1’s substitute shall attempt the free throws for the personal foul against A1 followed by the attempts by Team B for the technical foul. (2-10-1c, 4-14-1)

I think this falls into the category of "unannounced change".

[PG_Ref]

Originally Posted by APG

Thoughts on this new casebook play?

*4.14.1 SITUATION D:

A1 is fouled by B1 while Team A is in double bonus. In frustration, A1 pushes B1 after the ball becomes dead. A1 is assessed a technical foul. A1 successfully makes both free throws for the personal foul assessed to B1. B3 is ready to attempt the free throw for the technical foul by A1. The official scorer notifies the officials that the technical foul on A1 was his/her fifth.

RULING: Officials notify the Team A coach and A1 of the disqualification and allow a substitute for A1. A correctable error has occurred by allowing the wrong player (A1) to attempt the free throws for the personal foul and has been discovered within the timeframe to correct. The free throws by A1 are cancelled and A1’s substitute shall attempt the free throws for the personal foul against A1 followed by the attempts by Team B for the technical foul. (2-10-1c, 4-14-1)

This ruling has been taken to NFHS for clarification. They are supposedly going to issue a correction along with a few other seemingly contradictions between rule and caseplay. Hopefully they will correct and not confuse further.