NC: Kentucky vs UConn

[Camron Rust]

Originally Posted by Nevadaref

Pretty tough to define it as continuous motion when the other hand is used to shoot the ball.

Not sure I've ever heard that interpretation before. If it is all in one effort/motion, I view it as continuous.

[just another ref]

Only time I've seen this argument is when the contact knocks the ball completely free, then the airborne player grabs it out of the air and puts it in.

[rockyroad]

Any chance we can get video of the play Nevadaref is talking about?? I didn't see it, and am having a hard time picturing what is being discussed...did the player jump to shoot right handed, get hit, and then shift ball to left hand and shoot before landing?

[dahoopref]

2nd half at 18:05

Attempted dunk by UConn player is blocked by UK player but continues to the rim. UConn player appears to still have ball in hand to continue the dunk, ball hits the rim, but dunk is not completed.

The crew goes to the monitor and resets the shot clock.

Please correct me if I'm wrong, but was there a NCAA video bulletin last season about this play and to NOT reset the shot clock?

[johnny d]

Originally Posted by dahoopref

2nd half at 18:05

Attempted dunk by UConn player is blocked by UK player but continues to the rim. UConn player appears to still have ball in hand to continue the dunk, ball hits the rim, but dunk is not completed.

The crew goes to the monitor and resets the shot clock.

Please correct me if I'm wrong, but was there a NCAA video bulletin last season about this play and to NOT reset the shot clock?

Correct, if the ball does not leave the shooters hand, it is not considered a shot clock attempt and the shot clock should not be reset.

[twocentsworth]

Originally Posted by johnny d

Correct, if the ball does not leave the shooters hand, it is not considered a shot clock attempt and the shot clock should not be reset.

The NBA rule on shot clock resets is what the NCAA-M should go to.....ball hits rim (doesn't matter how/why) = reset. Currently in NCAA-M, clock reset ONLY when legal shot hits rim.

[dahoopref]

Originally Posted by johnny d

Correct, if the ball does not leave the shooters hand, it is not considered a shot clock attempt and the shot clock should not be reset.

Thanks for re-affirming my memory.

[Raymond]

Originally Posted by dahoopref

2nd half at 18:05

Attempted dunk by UConn player is blocked by UK player but continues to the rim. UConn player appears to still have ball in hand to continue the dunk, ball hits the rim, but dunk is not completed.

The crew goes to the monitor and resets the shot clock.

Please correct me if I'm wrong, but was there a NCAA video bulletin last season about this play and to NOT reset the shot clock?

You're are correct about the interp, but in the play in question here, the ball did leave A1's hand and hit the rim.

[dahoopref]

Originally Posted by BadNewsRef

You're are correct about the interp, but in the play in question here, the ball did leave A1's hand and hit the rim.

That's why I'd like to see the video of this play; I wasn't sure if it did.

[JetMetFan]

Guys -

I'll get to these tomorrow. It took a bit to find some of them (ahem... ) and now it's time for me to hit the hay. I think APG got dinged by the NCAA video police so he's off the grid for a bit.

[All_Heart]

You can watch the game here: Championship Game. The play occurs with 2.9 seconds left in the 1st half.

The switching of hands appeared to occur primarily b/c of the backboard being in the way of shooting with his right hand.

How would you rule on these plays?:

• The Micheal Jordan shot Video where he starts with one hand and switches to the other. Lets say he got fouled after starting his motion but before he switches hands are we not scoring it?

• B1 fouls A1 as he is jumping to shoot a layup. B2 is defending the basket and forces A1 to switch hands and shoot a reverse layup.

This isn't applicable to whether or not we would rule a shooting foul but for fun if you were the person in charge of inputting the stats at the scorers table would you record 1 made field goal on 2 attempts in Jordan's play?

In my opinion the rules support this as being a shooting foul but I think that its good Nevada brings the question up. Anytime we can think critically/differently it helps us in truly understanding the rules.

[Nevadaref]

Originally Posted by Camron Rust

Not sure I've ever heard that interpretation before. If it is all in one effort/motion, I view it as continuous.

The argument is simple. If the ball wasn't in his left hand when he was fouled and that is the hand the player eventually shoots it with, then he couldn't have been in the act of shooting FOR THAT TRY at the time of the foul.
To put it in question form: how could he have already begun the try when the ball wasn't even in the hand that he used to shoot?

If an official is going to consider that continuous motion, then the player should be permitted to execute a crossover dribble between the foul and the try. What difference does it make if the ball bounces on the floor or not in the switch between one hand and the other?

[Camron Rust]

Originally Posted by Nevadaref

The argument is simple. If the ball wasn't in his left hand when he was fouled and that is the hand the player eventually shoots it with, then he couldn't have been in the act of shooting FOR THAT TRY at the time of the foul.
To put it in question form: how could he have already begun the try when the ball wasn't even in the hand that he used to shoot?

If an official is going to consider that continuous motion, then the player should be permitted to execute a crossover dribble between the foul and the try. What difference does it make if the ball bounces on the floor or not in the switch between one hand and the other?

I've never seen anything that even remotely suggests what you're suggesting....that a try that starts in one hand can't be shifted to the other. The attempt to score begins when that start to go up with the ball and continues until they release the "try", lose the ball, or come down with it. Whatever specific movement they do with the ball after they start going up to score is of no consequence.

[Raymond]

Originally Posted by Camron Rust

Not sure I've ever heard that interpretation before. If it is all in one effort/motion, I view it as continuous.

Just b/c you view it one way doesn't mean it's correct, or what's interpreted elsewhere is incorrect.

I know I saw Harrison go to through lane in the 2nd half, get bumped, then pass the ball off. And I know I saw the Crew Chief indicate a "pass off" and give Harrison bonus free throws instead of 2 shots.

[Camron Rust]

Originally Posted by BadNewsRef

Just b/c you view it one way doesn't mean it's correct, or what's interpreted elsewhere is incorrect.

I know I saw Harrison go to through lane in the 2nd half, get bumped, then pass the ball off. And I know I saw the Crew Chief indicate a "pass off" and give Harrison bonus free throws instead of 2 shots.

True, but have you ever heard anyone say that shifting the ball from one hand to the other ends the try?

And I agreed with the pass off call. I don't think he was in the shooting motion on that play...not because he ultimately passed but because he was never in a shooting motion.