Euro step travel last minute Dayton/Syr no way it gets called

[jeremy341a]

Originally Posted by BadNewsRef

are you competing with Jeremy for worst Video Awards?

Yeah but I just posted other bad videos. I didn't make them. I think I lost my spot on the throne.

[JRutledge]

I am sorry, I do not see a travel.

Peace

[ballgame99]

Originally Posted by JRutledge

I am sorry, I do not see a travel.

Peace

the view from the back (:48 of video) shows the left foot down and dribble ended (both hands on ball), steps on to right foot, steps on to left foot again, finish. I didn't catch it watching live, or from the sideline angle. So I'm in the group that says this is a travel but one that I would probably not call unless I had a completely unobstructed view and knew what I was looking at.

[JRutledge]

Originally Posted by ballgame99

the view from the back (:48 of video) shows the left foot down and dribble ended (both hands on ball), steps on to right foot, steps on to left foot again, finish. I didn't catch it watching live, or from the sideline angle. So I'm in the group that says this is a travel but one that I would probably not call unless I had a completely unobstructed view and knew what I was looking at.

You do not see the ball clearly, which is one of the most important part of calling a travel. All angles are obstructed to some extent and it is a judgment if you feel that he has completely gathered the ball with a foot on the floor or in the air.

To me it has to be very obvious, not something we have to slow down to see.

Peace

[Multiple Sports]

Originally Posted by jump stop

I agree I need some better video skills

Stop video at :48 Ball clearly gathered with 2 hands with left foot on floor, he swings ball over his head and right foot is now on floor ( so now left foot is established as pivot foot), he then brings left foot back to floor and shoots. My crusade is that this is a clear travel that does not get called.

I'm glad you call this a crusade because you could be fighting this cause for a long time...... I just don't see a travel and quite frankly if you called this on a consistent basis, I don't think you would be around that long in a certain leagues.

As far as the whole Jeremy thing, I think we may have scared him away !!!!!

[Raymond]

Originally Posted by ballgame99

the view from the back (:48 of video) shows the left foot down and dribble ended (both hands on ball), steps on to right foot, steps on to left foot again, finish. I didn't catch it watching live, or from the sideline angle. So I'm in the group that says this is a travel but one that I would probably not call unless I had a completely unobstructed view and knew what I was looking at.

Originally Posted by JRutledge

You do not see the ball clearly, which is one of the most important part of calling a travel. All angles are obstructed to some extent and it is a judgment if you feel that he has completely gathered the ball with a foot on the floor or in the air.

To me it has to be very obvious, not something we have to slow down to see.

Peace

The view from the back has the ball disappearing, I do not see clear possession from that angle until the right foot is down (hating that I cursed my eyes to this video in the first place).

[MD Longhorn]

Originally Posted by jump stop

Stop video at :48 Ball clearly gathered with both hands.

Your definition of clearly and mine seem to differ greatly. I can't even see 4/5 of the ball, nor can I see one of the hands, at 0:48. If you can, I applaud you on your xray vision, sir.

Not a travel. Not at any point in the game.

[Rich]

Originally Posted by ballgame99

the view from the back (:48 of video) shows the left foot down and dribble ended (both hands on ball), steps on to right foot, steps on to left foot again, finish. I didn't catch it watching live, or from the sideline angle. So I'm in the group that says this is a travel but one that I would probably not call unless I had a completely unobstructed view and knew what I was looking at.

Two hands on the ball doesn't mean he's gathered/possessed it. Those on this crusade seem to be wanting to judge the pivot foot the instant the ball is touched.

[OKREF]

Originally Posted by Rich

Two hands on the ball doesn't mean he's gathered/possessed it. Those on this crusade seem to be wanting to judge the pivot foot the instant the ball is touched.

What does two hands on the ball mean if it doesn't mean possession?

[Camron Rust]

Originally Posted by Rich

Two hands on the ball doesn't mean he's gathered/possessed it. Those on this crusade seem to be wanting to judge the pivot foot the instant the ball is touched.

It might not in 0.1% of the cases, but in the overwhelming majority of cases, two hands on is holding the ball. Two hand on that remain on is the start of a hold. What else could it be?

[Rich]

Originally Posted by Camron Rust

It might not in 0.1% of the cases, but in the overwhelming majority of cases, two hands on is holding the ball. Two hand on that remain on is the start of a hold. What else could it be?

Start of, exactly. I'm not judging the pivot foot status at that instant, which is what all the stop-action video people are trying to do. I'm ensuring that the ball is actually gathered/possessed first.

[Camron Rust]

Originally Posted by Rich

Start of, exactly. I'm not judging the pivot foot status at that instant, which is what all the stop-action video people are trying to do. I'm ensuring that the ball is actually gathered/possessed first.

When the hold starts and is when the pivot foot restrictions begin. The rules define no window of activity that is excepted. The rules don't define anything else. You may wait to see if it remains in control to confirm they really did catch it but the pivot foot restrictions still began when they got two hands on the ball.

[Rich]

Originally Posted by Camron Rust

When the hold starts and is when the pivot foot restrictions begin. The rules define no window of activity that is excepted. The rules don't define anything else. You may wait to see if it remains in control to confirm they really did catch it but the pivot foot restrictions still began when they got two hands on the ball.

It takes time to recognize two hands and identify the pivot foot, though. Too many people want to stop the film at the instant the two hands touch the ball.

Sorry, I'm never going to try to cut it that fine. My job isn't playing "gotcha" with stuff like this.

(I really do think you can be "too good" when it comes to traveling. There's a reason why so many are "missed" and it's not because those guys can't identify it. Of course they can, they're top officials because they see things and can process them extremely well.)

[just another ref]

Originally Posted by Rich

It takes time to recognize two hands and identify the pivot foot, though. Too many people want to stop the film at the instant the two hands touch the ball.

Sorry, I'm never going to try to cut it that fine. My job isn't playing "gotcha" with stuff like this.

(I really do think you can be "too good" when it comes to traveling. There's a reason why so many are "missed" and it's not because those guys can't identify it. Of course they can, they're top officials because they see things and can process them extremely well.)

I don't know if this was your intention, but in a roundabout way what you're saying is that "err on the side of caution" has been taken to such an extreme that, to me, it is not acceptable. Most will agree that if slow motion instant replay is needed to make a travel call, it shouldn't be made. But isn't this like anything else, some officials can see it better than others? If I call a travel and replay proves it wrong, we all agree it's a bad call. But if I call a travel that you didn't see and replay proves it right, it seems to me that you, and others, in no way see it as a good call. Is this a fair assessment or not?