Looking for a balance

[CountTheBasket]

I won't attempt to explain every detail of this situation, as I'm not looking to get a specific answer about what happened to me. Just hoping to generate some discussion on some "game managment" and dealing with coaches when we're in that mode.

Monday night I'm working a GV game. Two teams I've had already, and I knew this was going to be a blowout from start to finish. Team B (visitior) has a head coach who is a whiner, begs for fouls, asks for "help" becasue of the score board, and generally doesn't seem to know a thing about coaching basketball. Reminds me of a rec league father who was "voluntold" he had to coach. Long story short, team A jumps out to something like a 20-2 lead, and B's coach starts with his usual routine of whining. It doesn't particularly bother me, but looking back I let him get away with too much. Add to that an empty quiet gym, and apparently to onlookers we let him get away with WAY too much. Winning Team A AD calls our comissioner and tells him we let the coach ride us the whole game etc. etc.

E-mail comes thru from the commish/assignor. We can't let this happen, why did it happen, the game was managed poorly etc. etc.

Last night, same scenario. GV blowout from the start, losing coach starts to get on me about a call he doesn't like. A few trips later I have a player control against his team. He's giving it to me the whole time I'm reporting then jumps up in the air and comes down and smacks the floor with both hands. With last night fresh in my mind I whack right there. At halftime my partners both have the same feelings: it was a charge, but close enough that I could've gone block with the scoreboard how it was. They don't necesarily disagree with the T, but with the score being the way it was I might have just been piling on and could've gone stern warning.

My long story leads me to this; How much should we/do we let the score and talent differential on the floor play into dealing with coaching behavior and the actual calling of the game. I'm finishing my second year as a varsity official, and I just constantly find myself leaving good competitive games happy and confident, while questioning myself leaving the "game managment" type of games. I assume this is just something that you develop a feel for with experience...?

[Da Official]

Great Technical! Coaches are not allowed to act like that without consequences - Forget the warning on that one.

I think you're right, balance is a feel and comes with experience....I still recommend calling the game as it is....as the game tape won't lie.

[Rich]

Originally Posted by CountTheBasket

I won't attempt to explain every detail of this situation, as I'm not looking to get a specific answer about what happened to me. Just hoping to generate some discussion on some "game managment" and dealing with coaches when we're in that mode.

Monday night I'm working a GV game. Two teams I've had already, and I knew this was going to be a blowout from start to finish. Team B (visitior) has a head coach who is a whiner, begs for fouls, asks for "help" becasue of the score board, and generally doesn't seem to know a thing about coaching basketball. Reminds me of a rec league father who was "voluntold" he had to coach. Long story short, team A jumps out to something like a 20-2 lead, and B's coach starts with his usual routine of whining. It doesn't particularly bother me, but looking back I let him get away with too much. Add to that an empty quiet gym, and apparently to onlookers we let him get away with WAY too much. Winning Team A AD calls our comissioner and tells him we let the coach ride us the whole game etc. etc.

E-mail comes thru from the commish/assignor. We can't let this happen, why did it happen, the game was managed poorly etc. etc.

Last night, same scenario. GV blowout from the start, losing coach starts to get on me about a call he doesn't like. A few trips later I have a player control against his team. He's giving it to me the whole time I'm reporting then jumps up in the air and comes down and smacks the floor with both hands. With last night fresh in my mind I whack right there. At halftime my partners both have the same feelings: it was a charge, but close enough that I could've gone block with the scoreboard how it was. They don't necesarily disagree with the T, but with the score being the way it was I might have just been piling on and could've gone stern warning.

My long story leads me to this; How much should we/do we let the score and talent differential on the floor play into dealing with coaching behavior and the actual calling of the game. I'm finishing my second year as a varsity official, and I just constantly find myself leaving good competitive games happy and confident, while questioning myself leaving the "game managment" type of games. I assume this is just something that you develop a feel for with experience...?

The winning coach was a jerk in the original scenario. Just goes to show that many coaches will not hesitate to throw the officials under the bus. Then again, it sounds like your assignor was willing to take the coach's word at face value, which is equally disturbing.

That said, you probably need to agree in the pregame (with your partners) that you're going to deal with a known quantity a certain way.

The first time he starts complaining, you need to have someone there to quietly remind him that you aren't going to tolerate that kind of stuff. Do it in a way that doesn't make you the center of attention.

Next time he whines, it's a warning that everyone in the gym can recognize.

Third time? Whack.

As you get more experienced in these situations, you may be able to get away with saying some things that will quiet the coach down - "hey, don't take it out on us" - but for right now, have a plan and make sure all of you are on the same page.

[letemplay]

Originally Posted by Rich

The winning coach was a jerk in the original scenario. Just goes to show that many coaches will not hesitate to throw the officials under the bus. Then again, it sounds like your assignor was willing to take the coach's word at face value, which is equally disturbing.

I don't see the OP this way. Sounds like it was the AD that went to the assignor. He was probably wandering about the gym doing diff stuff AD's do...making sure the chili is hot enough on the hot dogs at concession in lobby..and taking some parents complaints.

Also have a prob with something else in OP: partners suggesting afterwards that you could have called a block instead of what you saw as a charge, just because team was behind on scoreboard

[CountTheBasket]

Originally Posted by letemplay

I don't see the OP this way. Sounds like it was the AD that went to the assignor. He was probably wandering about the gym doing diff stuff AD's do...making sure the chili is hot enough on the hot dogs at concession in lobby..and taking some parents complaints.

Also have a prob with something else in OP: partners suggesting afterwards that you could have called a block instead of what you saw as a charge, just because team was behind on scoreboard

Yes the Home HC was not a jerk at all. I think the AD was just doing his thing as you stated, and because we were in a gym with about 11 fans he heard every word from the coach and thought these guys are letting him get away with an awful lot.

He said it was "close enough" to call it a block. I didn't say so in the locker room to the veteran R, but I felt myself that if that girls gets that spot and takes the contact she earned the charge and she's getting it from me. I'm all for ignoring some bumps that are iffy in a blowout scenario but couldn't just go the other way with this one.

[BatteryPowered]

Rich hit the nail on the head in my opinion. I will add that as you work more and more varsity games the coaches will start to learn you. Just like they know the other teams in their district, good coaches learn what officials will and will not tolerate and which ones are good. They can also smell indecisiveness (at least it seems that way). If you start doubting yourself they will take the opportunity to start working you.

I have seen two good examples personally. I always try to warn players early in the game about the lane and banging...and as I have posted, I count slowly on the three second violation. I finally had to call one in a game and as we are heading the other way, the coach of the team yells at his player "If that guy is calling you for three, you are killing the offense." The other was last weekend in a rec game. I tossed an assistant who insisted on being a jerk. The head coach for the other team knew me from when I called his two oldest sons in high school varsity. After the game he said "I felt like warning that poor assistant. I knew you were getting to your line real fast."

Bottom line, take the good feedback and good things you see in better officials and try to incorporate it in your game...and toss the rest. Stay confident in your ability and project calmness while on the floor.

[SE Minnestoa Re]

I don't give the trailing team a break just because they are behind. I consider that poor officiating.

I really don't see it any different than giving the home team the breaks.

I call what I believe is right and I live with it.

[Rich]

Originally Posted by letemplay

I don't see the OP this way. Sounds like it was the AD that went to the assignor. He was probably wandering about the gym doing diff stuff AD's do...making sure the chili is hot enough on the hot dogs at concession in lobby..and taking some parents complaints.

Also have a prob with something else in OP: partners suggesting afterwards that you could have called a block instead of what you saw as a charge, just because team was behind on scoreboard

Sorry, I read coach into it and should've said AD.

[Rich]

Originally Posted by SE Minnestoa Re

I don't give the trailing team a break just because they are behind. I consider that poor officiating.

I really don't see it any different than giving the home team the breaks.

I call what I believe is right and I live with it.

I agree. That said, when a team is down 30 points and the coach is frustrated -- this isn't the right time to miss one that benefits the losing team. It's why we have to stay mentally focused from beginning to end, even in the blowouts.

We're getting to the end of most of our seasons now and people are frustrated for different reasons. And officials that work a lot of games might find their ropes are a bit shorter than they were in November. All part of the territory.

[twocentsworth]

"You Promote What You Permit"

The level of tolerance you may have for coaches complaining, begging, or whining, should NOT change based on the score or competitiveness of the game.

Whatever techniques or methods you use to deal with coaches in a competitive game are the same you should employ in the blowout with no one in the gym. The sign of a true "professional" official is doing everything on a consistent basis, night in and night out.

[letemplay]

A coach that's down by 30 and showing his a$$ is maybe trying to get run. I mean what's the point man...your team is probably terrible (this night at least) and whose fault is that, while everyone in gym can see it. He needs to shut up and probably deserves LESS leeway (for me anyway) than someone in a tight contest, where naturally you'd expect some stuff.

[CountTheBasket]

Really appreciate all the feedback guys. I knew I blew it leaving the gym Monday night, just didn't feel like the game was managed well at all.

Then after handling what I felt needed to be handled last night and my partners referencing the scoreboard as a reason to back off my head was a mess.

Obviously every scenario has it's own variables, but I feel I learned from Monday night and wouldn't change anything about how I handled last night.

[SE Minnestoa Re]

Originally Posted by Rich

I agree. That said, when a team is down 30 points and the coach is frustrated -- this isn't the right time to miss one that benefits the losing team. It's why we have to stay mentally focused from beginning to end, even in the blowouts.

We're getting to the end of most of our seasons now and people are frustrated for different reasons. And officials that work a lot of games might find their ropes are a bit shorter than they were in November. All part of the territory.

Agreed

[MD Longhorn]

Honestly - the amount of nonsense you take from any coach should have absolutely nothing to do with the score. That said, I echo some of Rich's comments. Sounds like AD was being a tool - and your assignor taking him at face value is problematical. Just because the AD felt you let too much go doesn't mean you let too much go. And perhaps he heard more than normal because of the empty gym - it's entirely possible the coach was no worse than any other coach, it was just more hearable because of the lack of fans --- only YOU can really answer that for us. It bothers me quite a bit that the assignor assumed the AD was right.

[CountTheBasket]

Originally Posted by MD Longhorn

It bothers me quite a bit that the assignor assumed the AD was right.

He didn't, he claimed it was "hear say" in the email. Said he requested video, and also this particular school requests a clock operator (in this case a veteran official who had to have his knees done so is out of service this year) so he asked for his feedback which he gave to me; I just didn't want to make the OP longer than it already was.

We did let him get away with too much, what I first chalked up to his frustration with his team and being overly animated, I let get to this is annoying but look at the time and score let's just get out of here.

I can come up with a list of reasons why I wasn't as focused for this game as I should've been but none of it matters: it wasn't handled correctly. I've chalked it up as a learning experience and a good reminder to never let myself mentally take the night off no matter what I think the game has in store for me.