Looking for a balance

[Sharpshooternes]

How bout this for a whining coach? "I hear ya coach but if I wanted to hear nagging all night I would have just stayed home with my wife." That would be my first warning

[JRutledge]

I am very leery to pay too much attention to someone that is not an official. Even if the AD thinks something, that does not make it right. Even if that AD had officiating experience, that does not mean you took too much from the coach. I sometimes wonder why an assignor would even tell you something the AD said. It was not like you did something unprofessional or that was not very subjective. If the assignor has much of an issue, he could come out and see you work and make that determination on his own.

Peace

[Raymond]

Originally Posted by MD Longhorn

... It bothers me quite a bit that the assignor assumed the AD was right.

Originally Posted by CountTheBasket

He didn't, he claimed it was "hear say" in the email. Said he requested video, and also this particular school requests a clock operator (in this case a veteran official who had to have his knees done so is out of service this year) so he asked for his feedback which he gave to me; I just didn't want to make the OP longer than it already was.

...

Since I work for your assignor also, I was going to say I doubt he just took the AD's word for it. I was going to suggest that maybe he spoke with your partners also. Your post definitely clears that up in way consistent with my experiences with our assignor.

[JRutledge]

Originally Posted by BadNewsRef

Since I work for your assignor also, I was going to say I doubt he just took the AD's word for it. I was going to suggest that maybe he spoke with your partners also. Your post definitely clears that up in way consistent with my experiences with our assignor.

You would be surprised. Sometimes these guys in my experience are more concerned with keeping their jobs, then supporting the officials. And I get that thinking on many levels, but many assignors do not have the official's best interest at heart when they take these complaints. If you are not happy about the job we are doing, hire someone else or keep us away from that school. But do not try to micro manage a situation when you may not know the entire story, other than talking to an AD.

I do get it if you feel the official did not do their job, but why tell the official what the AD said? All that does is bring the wrong kind of thinking about that AD and that school to the official.

And I am speaking also from having a recent conversation with an assignor who came to me about a coach that was by all accounts an a-hole (said by both my partners long before I knew for myself).

Peace

[letemplay]

I wouldn't worry about it too much. It's a much higher % the AD is a former coach than a former official...so there ya go

[biggravy]

It's all been said, but in the second game... the coach that jumps up and slaps the floor with both hands that is an automatic T.

[Stat-Man]

Originally Posted by Da Official

I think you're right, balance is a feel and comes with experience.

Very True. I had a MS girls game this Fall where i let an AC say way more than i should have (Yeah, I know). But, on the drive home, I was determined that in the future, I'd learn from the day's experience and not allow that to happen again.

In the winter at a 7th grade boys game, I ended up whacking a head coach for his prolonged comments that ended with "Are you kidding me?" screamed in my ear after what i saw was a routine held ball. I ran into my assignor the next day as he was officiating the game after mine and he told me he thought it was a good T based on my report of the incident to him. I had wondered if maybe i was going too far the other way, but hearing his feedback helped me feel as if I was doing a better job finding that balance.

[Lcubed48]

Originally Posted by CountTheBasket

He didn't, he claimed it was "hear say" in the email. Said he requested video, and also this particular school requests a clock operator (in this case a veteran official who had to have his knees done so is out of service this year) so he asked for his feedback which he gave to me; I just didn't want to make the OP longer than it already was.

I, also, work for your assignor. I recently had a situation in a game that got questioned. I have no problem with his work behind the scene. He did his due diligence. And, the following week he put in a game showed me that I still had his trust.

PS - PM me if you want to discuss either situation further.

[rawhi1]

I had a middle school game score 45-44 with 10.8 seconds left. Team trailing just fouled had team leading shooting one in one. Trailing teams player was outside three point line but below free throw line extended. Player misses fIrst free throw and I call vioLation. Trailing teams coach comes out on floor my partner who is administering free throw points at him and go to explain the violation which doesn't occur that often. Coach doesn't want to listen I get cursed out and I T the head coach. I inform my partner what happened and try to get him to go back down and tell coach what's about to happen and put seatbelt on. One in one noone on line then technical foul shots and ball to shooting team. He just waves at me as in you handle it. To get the game done as expected I go back to talk to coach and I get the second barrel cursed out hand in face. I promptly and professionally toss the coach. He leaves after about a minute. Free throws shot his team loses by about 5 points thanks to him. My partner says after the game I should have passed on the first tech. I told him he didn't curse you out. I didn't mention that he could have helped me by keeping me from going back to talk to coach. All said we gonna make mistakes and make some tough calls. That's our job. When you feel a coach needs to be dealt with do it and have a good conscience. The word will get around that your not the one to try. Balance that with patience and common sense and you'll be ok.

[Raymond]

I'm not excusing coach's behavior, or saying the T's were bad.

But in the future don't let that type of violation happen. If your partner still has the ball, and you see a player where he/she isn't supposed to be, get the player to move back to a legal position.

[rawhi1]

The free thrower had already received the ball when I saw him and I moved down (2 man trail tableside) to free throw line too get a good look before I made the call. I understand what your saying but if we start coaching we,re not doing our job at that point. I've coach at middle school then varsity level won numerous conference and lower state and a state runner up championship. I coached my players who couldn't line up on blocks to line up from top of key back toward midcourt. I received rule books every year. Read em when I felt like it. Never saw that call until a game last year my fifth year officiating. I called it twice and heard of it being called by another official in a different game. If I see a player trying to line up but is allowed a place on the block we back him out above the three point line at top of Key. Anything else its on the coach and layer. If I start coaching I've given an advantage to the other team. The saying goes its hard but its fair.

[bob jenkins]

Originally Posted by rawhi1

The free thrower had already received the ball when I saw him and I moved down (2 man trail tableside) to free throw line too get a good look before I made the call.

In that case, it needs to be penalized.

But, both (all) officials should look before administering the FT, and it's not coaching, it's preventive officiating.

[Raymond]

Originally Posted by rawhi1

The free thrower had already received the ball when I saw him and I moved down (2 man trail tableside) to free throw line too get a good look before I made the call. I understand what your saying but if we start coaching we,re not doing our job at that point. I've coach at middle school then varsity level won numerous conference and lower state and a state runner up championship. I coached my players who couldn't line up on blocks to line up from top of key back toward midcourt. I received rule books every year. Read em when I felt like it. Never saw that call until a game last year my fifth year officiating. I called it twice and heard of it being called by another official in a different game. If I see a player trying to line up but is allowed a place on the block we back him out above the three point line at top of Key. Anything else its on the coach and layer. If I start coaching I've given an advantage to the other team. The saying goes its hard but its fair.

Which is why I said 'if your partner still has the ball'. The higher level you officiate the more supervisors expect their officials to prevent these type of nuisance calls from having to be called. Its not coaching, its managing the game.

[stick]

Originally Posted by Sharpshooternes

How bout this for a whining coach? "I hear ya coach but if I wanted to hear nagging all night I would have just stayed home with my wife." That would be my first warning

This didn't come from a coach but from a fan. "Hey ref, I'm going to tell your wife that your screwing us instead of her".
Normally I let what fans bark out roll off but I had to give that fan props for that one. One of the best lines I've ever heard!!