Question from my state's fan site...

[HokiePaul]

Originally Posted by rlarry

I personally have a problem with that. i interpet definite knowledge as a count. 10 sec backcourt, 5 second closely guarded even a silent 3 sec. count not an agreed upon guess by the crew. Last time the mrs. and i had marital relations, I say it lasted 10 secs, she swears 2, unfortunately the clock never started.

Sounds like 2 seconds off the clock in my association

[BryanV21]

Originally Posted by Scuba_ref

This is not a correctable error, it is a timing issue and in my opinion the TO vs TF doesn't come into play.

There are 5 correctable errors; 4 deal with free throws and the 5th with counting/or not a score.

Oftentimes people forget that those correctable errors refer to errors made by officials. Any error made by scorers/timers can be corrected.

[Scuba_ref]

Originally Posted by BryanV21

Oftentimes people forget that those correctable errors refer to errors made by officials. Any error made by scorers/timers can be corrected.

My point was not that this isn't something that can't be corrected, but rather that this error shouldn't cost a team a time out. As officials we need to know the status of the clock and we need to be in the habit on making sure that the clock runs when it is supposed to and stops when it should.

[Nevadaref]

Originally Posted by Scuba_ref

My point was not that this isn't something that can't be corrected, but rather that this error shouldn't cost a team a time out.

And you are incorrect about that. In post #13 of this thread I provided the rule for you and it clearly includes a timing mistake.

Thus if a coach wants to contend that a timing error occurred and no correction can be made, then BY RULE it will cost his team a time-out.

[Camron Rust]

Originally Posted by Nevadaref

And you are incorrect about that. In post #13 of this thread I provided the rule for you and it clearly includes a timing mistake.

Thus if a coach wants to contend that a timing error occurred and no correction can be made, then BY RULE it will cost his team a time-out.

I would think that the spirit and intent of that rule would result in no timeout if the crew confirmed a mistake was made but didn't have any sort of definite count to make a correction. In this case, a correction can be made if an official has a count. Whether the team is charged a T or not shouldn't depend on whether an official had a count or not.

[Raymond]

Originally Posted by Camron Rust

I would think that the spirit and intent of that rule would result in no timeout if the crew confirmed a mistake was made but didn't have any sort of definite count to make a correction. In this case, a correction can be made if an official has a count. Whether the team is charged a T or not shouldn't depend on whether an official had a count or not.

I agree, if it is acknowledged that a mistake occurred, but no definite knowledge of how much time should come off, then the team shouldn't be penalized. The coach met his burden of pointing a real timing mistake.

And I do have at least one supervisor who tells us we need to take off at least 0.4 if a player on the court catches ball, based on the rule regarding needing at least 0.4 on the clock to catch and shoot.

[deecee]

Originally Posted by Camron Rust

I would think that the spirit and intent of that rule would result in no timeout if the crew confirmed a mistake was made but didn't have any sort of definite count to make a correction. In this case, a correction can be made if an official has a count. Whether the team is charged a T or not shouldn't depend on whether an official had a count or not.

+1. My sentiments exactly.

[bob jenkins]

Originally Posted by Nevadaref

Correct. The coach takes the risk of the CE challenge costing him the time-out. Remember the rule states that the coach goes to the table to request a time-out. It simply isn't charged if a CE is corrected or prevented.

Anyone who wouldn't charge the excessive TO and the accompanying team technical foul is just wrong and making up his/her own rulings.

I agree with Nevada, but I'm also telling the coach his options and the "consequences" before we begin any review.

edit: This isn't a CE in HS. No TO charged.