Disconcertion From The Bench

[Camron Rust]

Originally Posted by Smitty

I have to agree with this. The response from MTD was way out of proportion with the issue.

Mark may have gone way overboard on it but he was right in that it shouldn't be ignored.

[Adam]

Originally Posted by stripes

MTD, please stop shouting and get off your high horse. Don't try and patronize me by using bold font and capital letters. Shouting and high post counts don't make you right. Trying to tell me to leave officiating because you disagree with me is ludicrous. I don't know who died and made you the over-lord of officiating, but here is a news flash: you're not that guy. You don't know a thing about me, my officiating or my "intestinal fortitude." If you, or anyone else, wants to call things like this, I can't stop you, but what I end up doing in my games is cleaning up the mess from people doing things like this.

If you don't like my opinions, ignore them. I have found that easily done with you.

Regardless of how inappropriate MTD's response was, have to ask. What sort of mess are you cleaning up? 1. I've never had a bench pull crap like this. 2. I've never had a coach complain about the noise from other bench.

What mess are you talking about?

[Adam]

Originally Posted by stripes

Totally disagree. Noise and distractions are part of the game. If you want to open that can of worms...be my guest. I see nothing wrong with what the bench personnel were described as doing. IMO, a FT shooter should be able tune out the things described and that makes them, once again, IMO, something to ignore.

Noise and distractions? Yes. Concerted chanting and stomping from the bench? Nope. Fans get to do all sorts of things coaches and players can't. This is no exception.

[Smitty]

Originally Posted by Camron Rust

Mark may have gone way overboard on it but he was right in that it shouldn't be ignored.

That's not what I said. His response was so ridiculously extreme that whatever message he might have been trying to send was lost in the exaggeration. Knowing when to subdue the bench is subjective and relative to the situation. If you have a packed gym where everyone in the stands is screaming and shouting during a free throw and the bench players are stomping their feet, are you going to stop everything and go tell the bench to knock it off? What is over the line may be different for one person as opposed to their partners as well.

[BayStateRef]

I understand "opponent" the way Billy does: anyone on the other team. The rules' writers would have said "players" if they wanted us to penalize only those on the floor.

I have called disconcertion on a coach...who yelled, precisely as the free throw shooter released the first of two free throws: "Box Out." I have also called it on a player, an inch on the north side of the 3-point line, who clapped and yelled "Rebound" at the precise moment that ball was released. We get to make judgments as to what is disconcertion. Absent any specific guidance (from the NFHS or from my assignor), I applied the rule as I understood it.

I do not agree this is a technical foul for unsporting conduct. The disconcertion rule fits perfectly here. There is no need to look for any other penalty.

[Adam]

Originally Posted by BayStateRef

I understand "opponent" the way Billy does: anyone on the other team. The rules' writers would have said "players" if they wanted us to penalize only those on the floor.

I have called disconcertion on a coach...who yelled, precisely as the free throw shooter released the first of two free throws: "Box Out." I have also called it on a player, an inch on the north side of the 3-point line, who clapped and yelled "Rebound" at the precise moment that ball was released. We get to make judgments as to what is disconcertion. Absent any specific guidance (from the NFHS or from my assignor), I applied the rule as I understood it.

I do not agree this is a technical foul for unsporting conduct. The disconcertion rule fits perfectly here. There is no need to look for any other penalty.

While I agree with you, I don't agree with your "the rules' writers would have said 'players'" point. I don't share your confidence in their skills.

[MD Longhorn]

Originally Posted by Smitty

That's not what I said. His response was so ridiculously extreme that whatever message he might have been trying to send was lost in the exaggeration. Knowing when to subdue the bench is subjective and relative to the situation. If you have a packed gym where everyone in the stands is screaming and shouting during a free throw and the bench players are stomping their feet, are you going to stop everything and go tell the bench to knock it off? What is over the line may be different for one person as opposed to their partners as well.

I agree his response was rather extreme. However, I believe he tried talking some sense into him without that extreme response several times.

It's like when I say something to my child, 3-4 times in increasing volume until the final time I'm yelling and they say, "Why are you YELLING?!?!" Um .. because normal volume wasn't working!

[Smitty]

Originally Posted by MD Longhorn

I believe he tried talking some sense into you without that extreme response several times.

Wasn't me. I was just defending his point (the guy who was the target of the red yelling).

[MD Longhorn]

Originally Posted by Smitty

Wasn't me. I was just defending his point (the guy who was the target of the red yelling).

True. My bad. I've corrected my post.

[rockyroad]

Have to agree with Smitty. Taking a very small issue and telling someone to get out of officiating if they can't handle it "right" is way, way, way over the top.

[BillyMac]

Originally Posted by stripes

Something to ignore.

Originally Posted by JRutledge

Something solved with a quick word. I do not think we need to make much more out of it then that.

Agree 100% with JRutledge. "A quick word" is not ignoring.

[BillyMac]

Originally Posted by MD Longhorn

Being right is what makes him right.

If I haven't already done it this week, I'm nominating this for Post O' The Week.

[BillyMac]

Originally Posted by Adam

I don't share your confidence in their skills.

... nor the skills of the rules editor.

[bob jenkins]

Originally Posted by BillyMac

Agree 100% with JRutledge. "A quick word" is not ignoring.

Put me in this camp too. and, while MTD was "over the top", I understand how he got there.

[RookieDude]

Thanks a lot guys...now I might pay attention to something that might not need much attention.

You know...kind of like that song you just can't get out of your head.

I honestly can not think of a time when the bench has disconcerted a free thrower...but then again, I don't do girls games.