Gonzaga / Southern video (Added)

[JRutledge]

Originally Posted by Judtech

I try to do what makes my Supervisor happy!

Good. And since I have several of them and a state organization I answer to on two different fronts, I do not see anyone from those positions telling me that this situation would result in a double foul. We all have different masters to answer to.

Peace

[Judtech]

Originally Posted by JRutledge

Good. And since I have several of them and a state organization I answer to on two different fronts, I do not see anyone from those positions telling me that this situation would result in a double foul. We all have different masters to answer to.

Peace

One of mine would say 'That will learn you to give a preliminary'. Another would say 'Get together and figure it out'

[Raymond]

This is what I know:

Rick Schnur, James Barker, and crew chief Teddy Valentine judged/determined/pre-gamed that merely putting 2 fists in the air does not constitute a block mechanic on a double-whistle crash.

Each one of us is free to pre-game this scenario in our contests and ajudicate it differently. Just b/c you would handle it differently doesn't make what these 3 officials did wrong.

[Raymond]

Originally Posted by Judtech

Show me the rule supporting your position? I may have missed the 'When a preliminary is really a preliminary' section.

You won't find it which makes it a situation that falls to the discretion of the crew working that particular day in that particular game.

[icallfouls]

I think it is safe to say that we all have seen or been involved in a B/C play where 2 officials have different calls. Neither has given a preliminary, there is a 50/50 chance for either call and one official takes the call. They report the charge. The coach says to the other you official "you had a block, tell him."

In this case the L official yields to the T official, therefore it was never a Blarge. That is what happened here.

The only people who are discussing it at all are OFFICIALS, because the actions are TYPICAL - not 100% - of calling a block. No one (media, fans, teams) is complaining that the call should've been because it looked like the L was going to call something else. It is likely the coaches, players, and a hand full of fans noticed. But I can tell you just as many don't know they had different calls. Just ask my parents, sisters, brother-in-laws, wife and kids and the others at Buffalo Wild Wings that had no clue.

When it comes to their evaluations the L did not receive an ICC and the T got a CC.

[cmb]

Originally Posted by icallfouls

I think it is safe to say that we all have seen or been involved in a B/C play where 2 officials have different calls. Neither has given a preliminary, there is a 50/50 chance for either call and one official takes the call. They report the charge. The coach says to the other you official "you had a block, tell him."

In this case the L official yields to the T official, therefore it was never a Blarge. That is what happened here.

The only people who are discussing it at all are OFFICIALS, because the actions are TYPICAL - not 100% - of calling a block. No one (media, fans, teams) is complaining that the call should've been because it looked like the L was going to call something else. It is likely the coaches, players, and a hand full of fans noticed. But I can tell you just as many don't know they had different calls. Just ask my parents, sisters, brother-in-laws, wife and kids and the others at Buffalo Wild Wings that had no clue.

When it comes to their evaluations the L did not receive an ICC and the T got a CC.

Well the commentators picked up on it right away, so your family became aware of it even if they didn't know right away.

[junruh07]

There was another one with 6:20 to go in the first half of the WSU-Gonzaga game. They wen't with PC, but I couldn't really see if that was right or not.

[cmb]

WOW! This exact same play just happened again in the Wichita St./Gonzaga game somewhere in the 6:xx mark of the game. John Higgins (L) comes up with two hands (fists) as Mike Stuart (C) is sending it the other way. It's an epidemic!

[icallfouls]

Originally Posted by cmb

WOW! This exact same play just happened again in the Wichita St./Gonzaga game somewhere in the 6:xx mark of the game. John Higgins (L) comes up with two hands (fists) as Mike Stuart (C) is sending it the other way. It's an epidemic!

Good communication prevented another Blarge. Apparently Stuart and Higgins don't consider 2 hands up a preliminary for a Block, otherwise they would have gone with the double foul. I think we are in good company.

[junruh07]

I am also pretty sure that Mike Stuart is on the Butler-Marquette game.

[cmb]

Originally Posted by junruh07

I am also pretty sure that Mike Stuart is on the Butler-Marquette game.

Yep. My bad. It was John Gaffney.

[JRutledge]

Originally Posted by icallfouls

Good communication prevented another Blarge. Apparently Stuart and Higgins don't consider 2 hands up a preliminary for a Block, otherwise they would have gone with the double foul. I think we are in good company.

As I said before, only on this board is this even a discussion.

Peace

[zm1283]

I don't know how you could interpret the Lead's actions as anything else than a block signal in progress that the Trail stops. Everyone arguing differently simply wants to defend the officials at all costs.

This was a barge.

[JRutledge]

Originally Posted by zm1283

I don't know how you could interpret the Lead's actions as anything else than a block signal in progress that the Trail stops. Everyone arguing differently simply wants to defend the officials at all costs.

This was a barge.

Like I have said before, show us where a rule or interpretation suggests that any movement is considered a "signal" and then you can make that ruling with great confidence. Otherwise you are giving your personal opinion that no one off this site would be likely having. Absolutely never heard this argument a day in my career before and we have talked about these situations many times before. Also many of us that you claim are defending the official at all costs often have criticized other officials for other things, so that holds little to no water either.

Peace

[Camron Rust]

What it boils down to is that the NCAA has declared that once a conflicting call has been made known by showing what you have, you can''t cancel one of them. They didn't say you have to completely show it, just that it be shown. If you know what he had, it was shown.

There was a great example of it being done right at around the 15min mark of Butler/Marq. The C merely raised his fist and nothing more while the L took the call. The C may or may not have had something different but he didn't show any indication of what he had and it was over. That is how it should be done. Show "nothing".