Coach Player Misconduct

[OKREF]

Sorry, but I found this after the thread was closed.

Rule 2-8-1

COMMENT: Unsporting tactics, in general, involve relationships.........It can also apply to the relationship of a player to teammates, and to the coach and members of the team. For example, profanity on the part of a participant, coach or member of the team is considered to be an unsporting act, whether or not the profanity is directed at any individual or is merely a means of "letting off steam."

This does seem to address the previous thread.

[BillyMac]

Originally Posted by OKREF

Sorry, but I found this after the thread was closed.

Rule 2-8-1 COMMENT: Unsporting tactics, in general, involve relationships. It can also apply to the relationship of a player to teammates, and to the coach and members of the team. For example, profanity on the part of a participant, coach or member of the team is considered to be an unsporting act, whether or not the profanity is directed at any individual or is merely a means of "letting off steam."

This does seem to address the previous thread.

Good citation, however, does it define profanity? There's the rub.

[OKREF]

Originally Posted by BillyMac

Good citation, however, does it define profanity? There's the rub.

I think any reasonable person can define profanity. I would say an F bomb is automatic, as would be SOB, GD. However other curse words may not illicit an automatic T.

I know that for me, I am probably going over to the coach and talking to him/her privately and quietly and letting him/her know that I heard what was said, and that the next time there will be consequences for it. Unless it is so blatently bad that it has to be addressed immediately.

[just another ref]

Originally Posted by OKREF

Sorry, but I found this after the thread was closed.

Rule 2-8-1

COMMENT: Unsporting tactics, in general, involve relationships.........It can also apply to the relationship of a player to teammates, and to the coach and members of the team. For example, profanity on the part of a participant, coach or member of the team is considered to be an unsporting act, whether or not the profanity is directed at any individual or is merely a means of "letting off steam."

This does seem to address the previous thread.

This a little thing, but this is actually from the case book 2.8.1

It is nice to see the main issue in that thread specified in black and white.
And yes, the f word is profanity, no matter where you live.

[OKREF]

Originally Posted by just another ref

This a little thing, but this is actually from the case book 2.8.1

It is nice to see the main issue in that thread specified in black and white.
And yes, the f word is profanity, no matter where you live.

Yea, I searched it on my phone app, doesn't specify case and rule when you do this.

[Adam]

Originally Posted by OKREF

I think any reasonable person can define profanity. I would say an F bomb is automatic, as would be SOB, GD. However other curse words may not illicit an automatic T.

I know that for me, I am probably going over to the coach and talking to him/her privately and quietly and letting him/her know that I heard what was said, and that the next time there will be consequences for it. Unless it is so blatently bad that it has to be addressed immediately.

I agree that it's pretty much profanity everywhere, but I disagree that it's "automatic."

[MD Longhorn]

Originally Posted by OKREF

I think any reasonable person can define profanity. I would say an F bomb is automatic, as would be SOB, GD. However other curse words may not illicit an automatic T.

Problem with "reasonable" is that everyone's version of it differs. In fact, mine differs from yours in this case and I suspect we're both reasonable people. I'd say F-bomb is the closest to automatic there is, but there's no such thing as automatic. If said quietly, at one's self, I might let it go. SOB and GD is nothing to me unless it's directed at me.

[Rich]

Originally Posted by OKREF

I think any reasonable person can define profanity. I would say an F bomb is automatic, as would be SOB, GD. However other curse words may not illicit an automatic T.

SOB and GD are absolutely nothing unless directed at me. Why would they be?

[OKREF]

I wasn't trying to rehash the old thread, just providing a citation that addresses this.

[JRutledge]

Originally Posted by Rich

SOB and GD are absolutely nothing unless directed at me. Why would they be?

Like I said before, just because I have a religious feeling I do not feel it is right for me to put than on others. Not everyone believes in God or not everyone thinks other words are over the top as well. If they are directing things at me then that is a different story. But you do not have to curse to get in trouble with what you say to opponents or officials IMO.

Peace

[pzebra]

Do your standards re language change at all when officiating a game between two private Christian schools?

[Raymond]

Originally Posted by pzebra

Do your standards re language change at all when officiating a game between two private Christian schools?

Nope. And it doesnt seem to change for players either.

[Rich]

Originally Posted by BadNewsRef

Nope. And it doesnt seem to change for players either.

One of my two career (25+ years) coach ejections was the head coach of a Baptist Bible high school. I still remember my partner deadpanning after the game, "That wasn't very Christian behavior, was it?"

[Terrapins Fan]

Originally Posted by Rich

SOB and GD are absolutely nothing unless directed at me. Why would they be?

Because one thing leads to another. If a player called another player a fag or queer, it's not directed at you. Should it be a T? I think so.

There are many words that should be "T"ed up. If you allow one, you have to allow all of them.

If you allow none, the kids will play by the rules.

[JetMetFan]

Originally Posted by Terrapins Fan

There are many words that should be "T"ed up. If you allow one, you have to allow all of them.

If you allow none, the kids will play by the rules.

This was my point in the other thread and has always been my stance. If you set the standard, the kids will hold to it because they want to play.

My situation is different than all of yours (I think) in that my main league mandates we follow that rule. Obviously if a player who suffers an injury swears there will be leeway and it's not as though we go looking for it. I tell kids in the captain's meeting "If you do it on the floor and we know who said it, we deal with it. If you do it on the bench we don't have to know who said it." As I said in the earlier thread, it has cut down on a lot of language that could be considered offensive.

In terms of what words/phrases are penalized, simple: we asked our supervisors and administrators in our meetings at the start of the season. Some didn't need definition (f***, s***) and others were clarified (SOB fell into the "T" category, by the way). GD raised a number of questions due to the religious connotation. It eventuallly fell into the T category after a mini-vote.

Another that overwhelmingly went into the T category - and the support was heavy among Black officials - was use of the N-word, even between teammates. We acknowledged its use in music, popular culture and the fact its considered "mainstream" in many communites but for many if not all of the officials none of that changed the word's historical use and purpose.

Some players have been thoughtful enough to quietly ask me "am I allowed to say (fill in the blank)?" My answer is always, "if you need to ask me, it's better you don't say it." So they don't.