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  #1 (permalink)  
Old Thu Dec 13, 2012, 09:38am
Often wrong never n doubt
 
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1st 3 man game tomorrow night.

I am going with a couple of verterns from our association tomorrow night. They are going to allow me to work the JV game 3 man with them. I have done alot of reading on the subject, especially the roations. However that doesn't mean I can actually apply what I have read. Any advice on the roations and how to keep them straight? Either way I am excitied to be able to work with some veterens as I'm sure they will give me a ton of great advice related not only to 3 man but also to officiating in general.
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Old Thu Dec 13, 2012, 09:46am
Huck Finn
 
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If you have never worked a three-man game, and you are going to be doing so for the first time in a JV game, I don't think that is fair to the kids. Even though it is JV, it is important to the players.

Have you worked scrimmages three-man at least? Doing a lot of reading on the subject is not enough IMO.
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Old Thu Dec 13, 2012, 09:49am
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A good pre-game is essential.

Communications will be very important. By seeing globally (calling locally) peek at your partners to see where they are on the floor so you know if you need to move.

Knowing when to "go" as the L took some getting used to for me.

Ask for advice and guidance as the game goes along. Am I too high as the C? Did I miss a switch or rotation? Was that in my primary? Was the double whistle ok there?

Enjoy and have fun!
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Old Thu Dec 13, 2012, 10:02am
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Quote:
Originally Posted by tomegun View Post
If you have never worked a three-man game, and you are going to be doing so for the first time in a JV game, I don't think that is fair to the kids. Even though it is JV, it is important to the players.

Have you worked scrimmages three-man at least? Doing a lot of reading on the subject is not enough IMO.
I have never worked 3 man. I agree it is important to the players and will do my best. Do you think 3 man with two vets and me would be worse than 2 man with one vet and me? Not trying to sound like a jerk but honestly wondering as I have done some jv games already.
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Old Thu Dec 13, 2012, 10:10am
Huck Finn
 
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Do you haven't even worked three-man in a scrimmage?

I think you doing three-man for the first time with two "Vets" is essentially having the game worked two-man. You are going to have so many things going in your head that you will want to make sure you are in the right position and will likely revert to watching the ball so you can determine if you are in the right position.

I put Vets in quotes because I don't think this is the responsible thing for veteran officials do. You mentioned you have worked "some" JV games already. How many would that be?

Think old bull...walk down the hill.
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Old Thu Dec 13, 2012, 10:27am
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Originally Posted by tomegun View Post
Do you haven't even worked three-man in a scrimmage?

I think you doing three-man for the first time with two "Vets" is essentially having the game worked two-man. You are going to have so many things going in your head that you will want to make sure you are in the right position and will likely revert to watching the ball so you can determine if you are in the right position.

I put Vets in quotes because I don't think this is the responsible thing for veteran officials do. You mentioned you have worked "some" JV games already. How many would that be?

Think old bull...walk down the hill.
No i have not worked 3 man ever and haven't ever worked a scrimmage. Honestly I have worked 11 nights all double headers. Some middle school, some freshman, and one jv varisty night. As for having the game worked two man that is what most all games around here are other than championship games and district and on games. We did call and clear it with the school first.

Last edited by jeremy341a; Thu Dec 13, 2012 at 10:31am. Reason: mistake
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Old Thu Dec 13, 2012, 10:36am
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The point tome is trying to make is that working 3 man effectively is not simply adding another body on the floor.
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Old Thu Dec 13, 2012, 10:52am
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Originally Posted by Welpe View Post
The point tome is trying to make is that working 3 man effectively is not simply adding another body on the floor.
I agree as well. However I need to learn before being thrust into the position in a high pressure situation. The main reason for me going with them as the 3 of them were already going and they are allowing me to due the jv game in order for me to improve. It just happens to be night at one of the few schools around that do 3 man.
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Old Thu Dec 13, 2012, 10:57am
Huck Finn
 
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Originally Posted by jeremy341a View Post
No i have not worked 3 man ever and haven't ever worked a scrimmage. Honestly I have worked 11 nights all double headers. Some middle school, some freshman, and one jv varisty night. As for having the game worked two man that is what most all games around here are other than championship games and district and on games. We did call and clear it with the school first.
Does that mean 11 JV games and one varsity game? What level do you do predominantly?

If your association doesn't do much three-man, how much experience do your partners have?
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Old Thu Dec 13, 2012, 11:01am
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I did full three-man games for the first time over the summer at ref camp. It was quite an adjustment, to say the least, especially after you've been "locked in" to the two-man mentality for several years.

My advice is to pay close attention during pre-game, and make sure they take their time with you. You're going to be looking at a PCA that will seem foreign to you at first, but in time, it'll come.

My toughest adjustment was instantly going from a center to a trail without warning. While you're focused on your PCA, pay a little attention to the endline. The lead can and will cross the basketline to the opposite corner, and suddenly, you're the trail with a new PCA. Someone here can explain when to expect this better than I can.
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Old Thu Dec 13, 2012, 11:02am
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Quote:
Originally Posted by tomegun View Post
Does that mean 11 JV games and one varsity game? What level do you do predominantly?

If your association doesn't do much three-man, how much experience do your partners have?
11 nights total all double headers, one night was jv/varsity, several were freshmen, and some were middle school.

Predominantly some of everything but more of lower level. For example tonight I have Middle School boys, tomorrow night I am going with them to do JV game, Monday freshman boys and girls, tuesday jv and varsity girls, thursday jv and varsity boys.

They have quite a bit experience as they do most of the tournament trophy nights as well as post season. It is just most alot of the smaller school won't pay the extra for 3 man.
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Old Thu Dec 13, 2012, 11:04am
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Originally Posted by bainsey View Post
I did full three-man games for the first time over the summer at ref camp. It was quite an adjustment, to say the least, especially after you've been "locked in" to the two-man mentality for several years.

My advice is to pay close attention during pre-game, and make sure they take their time with you. You're going to be looking at a PCA that will seem foreign to you at first, but in time, it'll come.

My toughest adjustment was instantly going from a center to a trail without warning. While you're focused on your PCA, pay a little attention to the endline. The lead can and will cross the basketline to the opposite corner, and suddenly, you're the trail with a new PCA. Someone here can explain when to expect this better than I can.
Thanks and good points!
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Old Thu Dec 13, 2012, 11:04am
Often wrong never n doubt
 
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Quote:
Originally Posted by bainsey View Post
I did full three-man games for the first time over the summer at ref camp. It was quite an adjustment, to say the least, especially after you've been "locked in" to the two-man mentality for several years.

My advice is to pay close attention during pre-game, and make sure they take their time with you. You're going to be looking at a PCA that will seem foreign to you at first, but in time, it'll come.

My toughest adjustment was instantly going from a center to a trail without warning. While you're focused on your PCA, pay a little attention to the endline. The lead can and will cross the basketline to the opposite corner, and suddenly, you're the trail with a new PCA. Someone here can explain when to expect this better than I can.
Do you feel it is tougher to adjust if you have done two man for a long time?
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  #14 (permalink)  
Old Thu Dec 13, 2012, 11:12am
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Originally Posted by jeremy341a View Post
Do you feel it is tougher to adjust if you have done two man for a long time?
Certainly. Like anything else, you get locked into a certain method. You also just getting used to looking at the floor within a center's PCA, and suddenly, you're not the center anymore. That was the toughest part for me.
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Old Thu Dec 13, 2012, 11:40am
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Quote:
Originally Posted by tomegun View Post
Do you haven't even worked three-man in a scrimmage?

I think you doing three-man for the first time with two "Vets" is essentially having the game worked two-man. You are going to have so many things going in your head that you will want to make sure you are in the right position and will likely revert to watching the ball so you can determine if you are in the right position.

I put Vets in quotes because I don't think this is the responsible thing for veteran officials do. You mentioned you have worked "some" JV games already. How many would that be?

Think old bull...walk down the hill.
My first 3-person experience was in a high-profile Christmas tournament in 1995. I remember it mainly because I had to grab my grizzled vet R from going in the stands after some yahoo. Can't even remember the weird mid-90s mechanics we worked at the time.

Around here, I'd say "it depends." At some of the bigger schools / conferences, the JV games are better than small school varsity games and would be, IMO, a horrible place to break in a newbie.

A small school girls JV game? Perfect place -- little pace, plenty of time to be able to focus on mechanics, coverages, etc.

You don't get good at 3-person working only scrimmages and camps, but it's probably best to include quite a bit of that in your plan.
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