Slow season coming - rule changes?

[Camron Rust]

Originally Posted by JRutledge

No there is not. If we did what was suggested people would get thrown out for words that are blocked on this site that do not offend but a few people. Then there would be a debate every game what was profane. Also I expect older kids to say things that younger kids should not say. It is the reality and we potentially could have 18 year olds on games, so that would be silly to have an across the board rule IMO.

Peace

Or, if enough people call it, any profane or borderline profane behavior would largely stop. Players only say things they do because someone allows them to do so.

[JRutledge]

Originally Posted by Camron Rust

Or, if enough people call it, any profane or borderline profane behavior would largely stop. Players only say things they do because someone allows them to do so.

That is the problem, what is borderline profane? I know people that get offended if you say "G0D D@am" and others that do not believe in God would not be offended. So who defines what that line is? I do not see the NF doing anything like that because there are language usage that are different from one area to another. And I doubt all older people are aware of every slang, euphemism or double entendre that is used in different areas as well.

Peace

[Raymond]

Originally Posted by JRutledge

That is the problem, what is borderline profane? I know people that get offended if you say "G0D D@am" and others that do not believe in God would not be offended. So who defines what that line is? I do not see the NF doing anything like that because there are language usage that are different from one area to another. And I doubt all older people are aware of every slang, euphemism or double entendre that is used in different areas as well.

Peace

There are also some cultural words that may offend or be known by some officials that are not known by others.

Or how about a game in which both teams are proficient in Spanish but only 1 of the 3 officials speaks Spanish?

We already have the tools to handle profanity and unacceptable language. It always going to come down to judgment and what is or isn't acceptable in the area you work.

[SE Minnestoa Re]

Minnesota has a 35-point rule for all games beginning with 9 minutes to go at the end of the game. It is a good rule. Coaches can get all their players in. Where it helps is bad feelings seem to be reduced.

[tw1ns]

Iowa 35 point rule for boys only enforced in 2nd half and if it dips below 25pts then resume timing as normal. And i agree with earlier statement that it should be for GIRLS and probably not boys. 2 different unions, 2 different rules. what'ya going to do.

[Adam]

Originally Posted by tw1ns

Iowa 35 point rule for boys only enforced in 2nd half and if it dips below 25pts then resume timing as normal. And i agree with earlier statement that it should be for GIRLS and probably not boys. 2 different unions, 2 different rules. what'ya going to do.

CO, JV only by conference adoption.

[Camron Rust]

Originally Posted by BadNewsRef

There are also some cultural words that may offend or be known by some officials that are not known by others.

It doesn't matter that some portion of officials are trash mouths and don't find a problem with profanity. If enough people called it, it wouldn't matter. The rest would even hear it for it to be an issue because the players would learn not to push the issue.

Originally Posted by BadNewsRef

Or how about a game in which both teams are proficient in Spanish but only 1 of the 3 officials speaks Spanish?

Originally Posted by BadNewsRef

We already have the tools to handle profanity and unacceptable language. It always going to come down to judgment and what is or isn't acceptable in the area you work.

Yes, we don't need a rules change, we just need officials to address it rather than sweep it under the rug so they can avoid making an unpopular decision.

[JRutledge]

Originally Posted by Camron Rust

It doesn't matter that some portion of officials are trash mouths and don't find a problem with profanity. If enough people called it, it wouldn't matter. The rest would even hear it for it to be an issue because the players would learn not to push the issue.

Being someone that works games in the city or with city teams (regardless of race BTW), I find it funny how there are certain officials (usually suburban officials) that cannot even identify certain comments, actions or body language that to officials like me clearly identify or address and others are oblivious to. It is much more than language or specific words.

Originally Posted by Camron Rust

Yes, we don't need a rules change, we just need officials to address it rather than sweep it under the rug so they can avoid making an unpopular decision.

A lot of officials cannot identify things to even address them. When you have never been in a culture or exposed yourself in social situation, you often would have no idea what to do if you have little exposure to it. Like I said before, not all offensive language are the words we think they are and not all actions or things that get a reaction are the same either.

Peace

[Camron Rust]

Originally Posted by JRutledge

Being someone that works games in the city or with city teams (regardless of race BTW), I find it funny how there are certain officials (usually suburban officials) that cannot even identify certain comments, actions or body language that to officials like me clearly identify or address and others are oblivious to. It is much more than language or specific words.




A lot of officials cannot identify things to even address them. When you have never been in a culture or exposed yourself in social situation, you often would have no idea what to do if you have little exposure to it. Like I said before, not all offensive language are the words we think they are and not all actions or things that get a reaction are the same either.

Peace

Being desensitized to bad language (verbal and otherwise) because you're around it so much doesn't mean it is ok.

[JetMetFan]

Originally Posted by Camron Rust

Being desensitized to bad language (verbal and otherwise) because you're around it so much doesn't mean it is ok.

I mentioned in another string somewhere that NYC Public Schools adopted a "no tolerance" rule regarding profanity in the 2010-11 season. During our preseason meeting a number of officials were "concerned," to say the least. Some of their questions:

*What if a player swears at a teammate?
*What if a player misses a shot and curses out loud to himself?
*What if a player curses after making a bad pass?

Every question was met with the same answer: "What does 'zero tolerance' mean?"

I have to say, two years in, I like the rule. The kids adjusted very fast. Eliminating calls where I gave a T to a kid/coach for swearing at an opponent or me I'd say I've called 15 or so.

As for the cultural aspect of things, I don't buy it. Black (which I am), White, Brown or Other the kids will respond if you set a boundary and hold to it. We remind them in the pregame swearing isn't allowed (I also tell them that includes the "N" word). If we bang the first one to do it, anyone who didn't understand gets with the program fast.

[JRutledge]

Originally Posted by Camron Rust

Being desensitized to bad language (verbal and otherwise) because you're around it so much doesn't mean it is ok.

It is about not identifying it. There are more words than the "F" or "S" word. And not everyone agrees that the "D" word is profanity either.

Peace

[Rich]

Originally Posted by Camron Rust

Being desensitized to bad language (verbal and otherwise) because you're around it so much doesn't mean it is ok.

Words are just that. A kid using a profanity because he missed a shot isn't the same thing as directing a profanity at another player or official.