Uncalled Cheap Shots

[JRutledge]

Originally Posted by ga314ref

Officials can't stop players from doing certain things, but we can remove their opportunity to do those things by ejecting them from the game. These officials didn't take care of business, and their lack of testicular fortitude is inexcusable.

We are not all powerful and even if we call something we will be scrutinized. I just do not buy it when people try to convince us that we have some say we do not have. It is just not true that we have that kind of power. The coach decides who actually plays and or he allows his kid to continue some kind of action. We can call all the fouls we like and they can ignore the consequences. There probably was only one call in this game that was shown that could be really seen as flagrant. And if we did not have a produced video claiming that was the case I doubt seriously that many here would be advocating such action in the first place.

I would like to think we have that kind of influence, but I have seen situations that take place and the officials called all the fouls in the world.

Peace

[Rich]

Originally Posted by JRutledge

We are not all powerful and even if we call something we will be scrutinized. I just do not buy it when people try to convince us that we have some say we do not have. It is just not true that we have that kind of power. The coach decides who actually plays and or he allows his kid to continue some kind of action. We can call all the fouls we like and they can ignore the consequences. There probably was only one call in this game that was shown that could be really seen as flagrant. And if we did not have a produced video claiming that was the case I doubt seriously that many here would be advocating such action in the first place.

I would like to think we have that kind of influence, but I have seen situations that take place and the officials called all the fouls in the world.

Peace

I get what you're saying, but calling earlier fouls intentional sends a message. Closing on the foulers and using your voice sends a message. Calling the flagrant foul when it happens sends a message.

Doing nothing sends a message, too.

[JugglingReferee]

I wonder how the officials are feeling now that the video went viral.

[gordon30307]

Originally Posted by JugglingReferee

I wonder how the officials are feeling now that the video went viral.

In the old Soviet Union they would have been banished to Siberia

[fullor30]

Originally Posted by JugglingReferee

I wonder how the officials are feeling now that the video went viral.

To me, this is the story. There are plenty of flagrant fouls everywhere everyday and I'm guessing they are dealt with accordingly.

I'm really puzzled by a varsity crew that passes the eye test, looks like a veteran crew, good mechanics from what is shown, failed to not only make the proper calls but seemed almost blase and aloof without the least bit of concern or any visible reaction to #5 foul in particular. Not one official at least 'closed down' on #5. I'm truly miffed and would love to know what they were thinking.

[tomegun]

Originally Posted by fullor30

...a varsity crew that passes the eye test...

I have a passion for improving officiating and forcing everyone - players, coaches, fans and parents - to shut their continuously running traps. Of course, I will not explain enough to get any of thee above close to basketball rule literate. Having said all of that, and not even sure if it is relevant, no this crew does not. One out of three passes the eye test and he seems to have his head in the cloud - holding his hand back up before reporting the "hold". If I was a parent, player or coach I wouldn't think the other two could keep up with the game based on how they look so they fail the eye test.

[JRutledge]

Originally Posted by RichMSN

I get what you're saying, but calling earlier fouls intentional sends a message. Closing on the foulers and using your voice sends a message. Calling the flagrant foul when it happens sends a message.

Doing nothing sends a message, too.

I am not talking about sending messages. Just stating that we can call whatever we want and if a coach and player do not care, then they will not care and there is not much we can do about it. Even if we call a flagrant foul there are coaches that will condone the behavior. How many times have we given a T to a player or a coach only for them to say, "I did not do anything."

I had a player used profanity and the big "F word" and I gave him a T. Do you know what the school claimed in a report later? They said he did not use any profanity and they focused on what I did based on an non-related issues with uniforms where we started the T. And I went directly to the coach who did not hear the words and told him word for word was was said by this player.

Coaches and players only behave properly if they have ethics or standards to live up to. If the coach was concerned about anything like that here the officials would not have had the opportunity to do anything like that. I doubt this kid even scored a point in the game as he showed no athleticism or ability in the game of basketball. We can send all the messages we like, if they do not have a conscious or a soul we are fighting an uphill battle.

Peace

[TheOracle]

Originally Posted by RichMSN

I get what you're saying, but calling earlier fouls intentional sends a message. Closing on the foulers and using your voice sends a message. Calling the flagrant foul when it happens sends a message.

Doing nothing sends a message, too.

Rich, you are 100% right. You can call it sending a message or whatever you want, but someone better have control of the game. Most of the time, you want to be invisible. This is a rare instance where you need to be demonstratively visible.

[Adam]

Originally Posted by TheOracle

(good stuff cut) Most of the time, you want to be invisible. (more good stuff cut)

No, we don't.

[ga314ref]

Originally Posted by JRutledge

We are not all powerful and even if we call something we will be scrutinized. I just do not buy it when people try to convince us that we have some say we do not have. It is just not true that we have that kind of power. The coach decides who actually plays and or he allows his kid to continue some kind of action. We can call all the fouls we like and they can ignore the consequences. There probably was only one call in this game that was shown that could be really seen as flagrant. And if we did not have a produced video claiming that was the case I doubt seriously that many here would be advocating such action in the first place.

I would like to think we have that kind of influence, but I have seen situations that take place and the officials called all the fouls in the world.

Peace

...is I'm competent. I don't believe any officials have powers that go beyond adjuducating a contest, but part of that role is recognizing that we are there to keep order. If a coach decides he wants to have five goons come out to try to turn a basketball game into a brawl, the best I can do, and will do, is call the fouls that will get those goons out of the game. A lot of it may have to do with where I live and officiate, but I can guarantee there's no varsity crew in my organization that would have tolerated this kind of play without ejecting someone. Our officials are not intimidated by players, coaches, crowds, or the import of the game. Our assignors and state overseers stand with us, but if we screw up, we're expected to take it in the chin.

Our society has changed. Ten years ago, this game would have faded to become a local folkstory; today, it's international news. Our profile has been raised, and this crew's lack of action reflects on us all.

So I agree, officials have no special powers, but if we're afraid to use the ones we have, we get games like this, and the critcism and scrutiny that follows.

[JRutledge]

Originally Posted by ga314ref

Our society has changed. Ten years ago, this game would have faded to become a local folkstory; today, it's international news. Our profile has been raised, and this crew's lack of action reflects on us all.

So I agree, officials have no special powers, but if we're afraid to use the ones we have, we get games like this, and the critcism and scrutiny that follows.

My comments have nothing to do with fear or not having courage. Just stating that we can call what we like and the players and coaches have to realize the consequences, be afraid of the consequences and take appropriate action or adjust. If they do not do that, all the fouls we call is not going to change anything. Obviously the coach was not thinking of the consequences because he obviously let this player stay. I know players that will commit one stupid foul and they do not play again that night.

Once again, a lot of this is based on your experience and standards as well. If that was not the case we would all agree on every foul called and what the call should have been. Still I see a lot of disagreement.

Peace