Illegal Substitute?

[SNIPERBBB]

I really do not believe that this case plays applies here. The T is for when the name is added to the book.

With the foul 15 has to be added to the
book. In the case play the name does not have to be added.

[BillyMac]

Originally Posted by SNIPERBBB

With the foul 15 has to be added to the
book. In the case play the name does not have to be added.

Originally Posted by bob jenkins

Reference, please.

Same question.

[Raymond]

Originally Posted by BillyMac

Same question.

Your citation doesn't address a player who has scored or committed a foul.

[BillyMac]

Originally Posted by BadNewsRef

Your citation doesn't address a player who has scored or committed a foul.

Absolutely positively true. You got me. Red handed.

Please show me a citation in which said player scores, or commits a foul, while participating, before being substituted for, and the "error" in the scorebook is discovered while said player is not a "player" but is bench personnel.

I'm waiting. The clock is ticking (imagine the Jeopardy song here).

[SNIPERBBB]

After the 10-minute time limit specified in Article 1:

a. Change a designated starter unless necessitated as in 3-2-2a.

b. Add a name to the team member list.

c. Require the scorer to change a team member's or player's number in the scorebook.

d. Require a player to change to the number in the scorebook.

e. Have identical numbers on team members and/or players.

PENALTY: (Art. 2) One foul only per team regardless of the number of infractions. (Art. 2a) Penalized if discovered before ball becomes live to start game. (Arts. 2b, c, d) Penalized when they occur. (Art. 2e) Penalized when discovered.

[BillyMac]

Originally Posted by SNIPERBBB

After the 10-minute time limit specified in Article 1:
a. Change a designated starter unless necessitated as in 3-2-2a.
b. Add a name to the team member list.
c. Require the scorer to change a team member's or player's number in the scorebook.
d. Require a player to change to the number in the scorebook.
e. Have identical numbers on team members and/or players.
PENALTY: (Art. 2) One foul only per team regardless of the number of infractions. (Art. 2a) Penalized if discovered before ball becomes live to start game. (Arts. 2b, c, d) Penalized when they occur. (Art. 2e) Penalized when discovered.

Don't forget the casebook citation: No penalty is assessed since No. 25 is not currently in the game.

I'm still waiting to see a citation that differentiates between a player, not in the scorebook, who scores, or commits a foul, and a player who, while not in the book, doesn't score, or doesn't foul. In both cases the need to add the name to the scorebook is discovered after the player has been replaced by a substitute and is now bench personnel.

Cue the Jeopardy song. Where are Ken Jennings, and Mary Struckoff, when you need them?

By the way, I don't have the answer to this situation, I'm just trying to get a better handle on it.

[Camron Rust]

Originally Posted by BillyMac

Don't forget the casebook citation:

No penalty is assessed since No. 25 is not currently in the game.

Yet, that citation doesn't involve the recording of an infraction that is required to be recorded in the scorebook.

What I want to know is why the scorekeeper didn't speak up at the moment the foul was reported. Where did they record the foul?

[SNIPERBBB]

Originally Posted by BillyMac

Don't forget the casebook citation:

No penalty is assessed since No. 25 is not currently in the game.

You have to understand why there is no penalty in the caseplay. There is no penalty in the case play because in this situation we ARE NOT FORCED to add the name to the book thus there is no change in the book to be made until the player comes into the game.

That is not the case with the foul. Now if the ball becomes live again after this happens, its not too late to penalize.

[bob jenkins]

Originally Posted by SNIPERBBB

I really do not believe that this case plays applies here. The T is for when the name is added to the book.

With the foul 15 has to be added to the
book. In the case play the name does not have to be added.

Agreed. The case play is assuming that A25 didn't foul (and, probably, didn't score, but I'll admit there's more gray area here). Those who are high-lighting the "no penalty is assessed since No. 25 is not currently in the game" are over-applying it.

In the OP, A15 (I think) fouled, so must be added to the book, so there will be a T when that happens.