2011 Tournament Discussion Redux

[Pantherdreams]

Whether we believe the Texas player would be savy enough to count the chops or not, there is supposed to be visible signals of the 5 seconds. Kid sees 4 and asks for time out then gets a 5 second call because the chops do not match the count.

All evidence points towards an official error, but as a baketball fan that was not the difference in the game.

[JugglingReferee]

Just saw the clip on my SportsCentre.

I timed the play as did the sports report. They had 3.9s and I have 4.02s. That's not even close to being a violation.

Horrible call.

[JugglingReferee]

[Raymond]

Originally Posted by JugglingReferee

He aborted his 5th stroke to blow his whistle and looked like, to me at least, that he thought about granting the time-out and then decided to call the 5-second violation.

Me personally, I'm granting the time-out in that situation.

[Raymond]

I didn't see any of the FSU/ND game. What caused all the T's to be called?

[Jburt]

Did Texas have any TO remaining?

[Adam]

Originally Posted by Jburt

Did Texas have any TO remaining?

Not relevant to the discussion at hand, really. If they didn't, the proper call would have been to grant the TO and charge the TF (assuming it was requested in time) rather than ignore it and charge the 5 second violation.

[APG]

Originally Posted by Jburt

Did Texas have any TO remaining?

Yes, they had one remaining.

[BktBallRef]

Originally Posted by BadNewsRef

I didn't see any of the FSU/ND game. What caused all the T's to be called?

The only T I saw was an FSU player who complained about being tripped to the floor. Problem is his teammate tripped him. He came up yelling at the trail, WHACK, then tried to pretend he was yelling to his coach.

[Camron Rust]

Originally Posted by BadNewsRef

He aborted his 5th stroke to blow his whistle and looked like, to me at least, that he thought about granting the time-out and then decided to call the 5-second violation.

Me personally, I'm granting the time-out in that situation.

I just timed, with a stopwatch, from the instant he caught the ball to the movement of the arm for the violation. After about a 7-8 trials, I keep getting from 4.95 to 5.75.

It sure felt fast and it is hard to sync exactly with the short, grainy video clip but it really seems to be right on the money.

I think we're all just used to slow counts on throwins....I know when I've timed other officials in an evaluation, I've never found even one to be accurate in their pace...most are about 50% too slow or worse.

[APG]

Originally Posted by Camron Rust

I just timed, with a stopwatch, from the instant he caught the ball to the movement of the arm for the violation. After about a 7-8 trials, I keep getting from 4.95 to 5.75.

It sure felt fast and it is hard to sync exactly with the short, grainy video clip but it really seems to be right on the money.

I think we're all just used to slow counts on throwins....I know when I've timed other officials in an evaluation, I've never found even one to be accurate in their pace...most are about 50% too slow or worse.

I got closer to 4.2-4.5. I never got anywhere north of 5 much less closer to 5.75. Various sporting networks I've seen at most had 4.9.

[Camron Rust]

Originally Posted by AllPurposeGamer

I got closer to 4.2-4.5. I never got anywhere north of 5 much less closer to 5.75. Various sporting networks I've seen at most had 4.9.

It all depends on when you judge that he caught the ball....and I was being generous to the official....the earliest possible point that the player touched the ball. Even if it measured out at 5.0, it was uncharacteristically quick.

[Mendy Trent]

Originally Posted by AllPurposeGamer

I got closer to 4.2-4.5. I never got anywhere north of 5 much less closer to 5.75. Various sporting networks I've seen at most had 4.9.

I have heard Dick Cartmell lecture at camps a few times. He ALWAYS makes a big deal about "not splitting hairs on travels..... don't make marginal calls".... I think he should have taken his own advice on this play and granted the time-out.

[Jurassic Referee]

Originally Posted by JugglingReferee

Just saw the clip on my SportsCentre.

I timed the play as did the sports report. They had 3.9s and I have 4.02s. That's not even close to being a violation.

Horrible call.

How horrible will be decided if we don't see that official's name on a game report next weekend.

Supposedly, this is one of the criteria the NCAA uses to sort out who advances.