Louisiana Officials Possible Strike?

[just another ref]

My association is not a part of the work stoppage. I go where I am assigned. End of that story.

As to the work stoppage itself. The fees are what they are. The argument has been made that they are too low. Obviously that is a point of contention.
BUT, the wages were agreed to and the contracts were signed for this year. The pay raise in question would be for next year. When it was denied, you stop now? I don't do business that way.

[Jurassic Referee]

Originally Posted by just another ref

My association is not a part of the work stoppage. I go where I am assigned. End of that story.

As to the work stoppage itself. The fees are what they are. The argument has been made that they are too low. Obviously that is a point of contention.
BUT, the wages were agreed to and the contracts were signed for this year. The pay raise in question would be for next year. When it was denied, you stop now? I don't do business that way.

And as I read it, the officials were promised bi-yearly pay raises back in 2007 and none of those were ever implemented. Apparently the principals aren't too fond of following through on their promises also.

Jar, if you think $36/game is a fair high school rate, hey, work your tail off. And if your association wants to say t'hell with all the other associations that are trying to make things better for all officials in the state, then hey, all of them can work their damn tails off too working the games that the other officials are refusing to work. Me? I don't do business that way.

There's a reason that officials are only getting $36/game in your state. And imo your association is part of that reason. I can understand you having to do what your association tells you to do. I can't understand your association's stance though.

[Eastshire]

I think JAR is right. If you signed the contract, you need to work the game. If you aren't being paid enough (and they're not being paid enough), don't sign the contract for next year.

They aren't a union (unless I'm really missing something and officials are in fact school employees and have a certified union in LA). They're not on strike; they're just breaking contracts. The schools will have no trouble nailing them to the wall on breach of contracts suits. The only worse thing than getting paid $36 to call a varsity game would be paying a breach of contract fine for not calling a varsity game.

Honor your word, then stop dealing with people who don't pay you what you're worth.

[Jurassic Referee]

Originally Posted by Eastshire

I think JAR is right. If you signed the contract, you need to work the game. If you aren't being paid enough (and they're not being paid enough), don't sign the contract for next year.

They aren't a union (unless I'm really missing something and officials are in fact school employees and have a certified union in LA). They're not on strike; they're just breaking contracts. The schools will have no trouble nailing them to the wall on breach of contracts suits. The only worse thing than getting paid $36 to call a varsity game would be paying a breach of contract fine for not calling a varsity game.

Honor your word, then stop dealing with people who don't pay you what you're worth.

What contract does any official have with their association? Or with anybody? They can decline any game they want to.

Ridiculous logic imo. And it would never fly in any court of law.

[Eastshire]

Originally Posted by Jurassic Referee

What contract does any official have with their association? Or with anybody? They can decline any game they want to.

Ridiculous logic imo. And it would never fly in any court of law.

Your area must be different than mine. In my area, I sign a contract with the home school for every game I accept when they are assigned at the beginning of the season. You'd better believe they'd hold up in a court of law.

If the LA officials don't sign contracts individually, I would be very surprised if the associations don't. Nothing at this level gets done without a contract.

[Jurassic Referee]

Originally Posted by Eastshire

Your area must be different than mine. In my area, I sign a contract with the home school for every game I accept when they are assigned at the beginning of the season. You'd better believe they'd hold up in a court of law.

If the LA officials don't sign contracts individually, I would be very surprised if the associations don't. Nothing at this level gets done without a contract.

What our areas do is meaningless. It's what LA does that counts.

In the stories already posted, it was confirmed that no LA officials sign individual contracts and no LA officials are employed in any way by the LHSAA. Every LA official is an independant contractor and can turn down any game they choose to. The contract is between the LHSAA region and an individual officials association. And if that association can't supply officials because of a lack of sub-contractors willing to work for them, then that ain't the sub contractors problem.

Methinks the average official in LA is finally saying enough is enough.

[Adam]

Originally Posted by Eastshire

I think JAR is right. If you signed the contract, you need to work the game. If you aren't being paid enough (and they're not being paid enough), don't sign the contract for next year.

They aren't a union (unless I'm really missing something and officials are in fact school employees and have a certified union in LA). They're not on strike; they're just breaking contracts. The schools will have no trouble nailing them to the wall on breach of contracts suits. The only worse thing than getting paid $36 to call a varsity game would be paying a breach of contract fine for not calling a varsity game.

Honor your word, then stop dealing with people who don't pay you what you're worth.

I don't GAF if the union is "certified." Negotiating takes strength and that comes in numbers.

As for breach of contract, are you high? We're private contractors and thus we aren't obligated to accept any assignment, especially one that's paying such crap wages.

[Eastshire]

Originally Posted by Snaqwells

I don't GAF if the union is "certified." Negotiating takes strength and that comes in numbers.

As for breach of contract, are you high? We're private contractors and thus we aren't obligated to accept any assignment, especially one that's paying such crap wages.

Right, we aren't required to sign the contract for the game. But once you have signed the contract for the game you are bound by the terms of that contract. If they didn't like the pay (and who would), they shouldn't have signed the contract.

I agree that they should all in mass refuse new contracts, but they are bound by the individual contracts they have already signed (assuming it works there like it does here). There will be hell to pay for breaking the contracts they had already accepted.

[ref2coach]

Originally Posted by Jurassic Referee

And as I read it, the officials were promised bi-yearly pay raises back in 2007 and none of those were ever implemented. Apparently the principals aren't too fond of following through on their promises also.

Jar, if you think $36/game is a fair high school rate, hey, work your tail off. And if your association wants to say t'hell with all the other associations that are trying to make things better for all officials in the state, then hey, all of them can work their damn tails off too working the games that the other officials are refusing to work. Me? I don't do business that way.

There's a reason that officials are only getting $36/game in your state. And imo your association is part of that reason. I can understand you having to do what your association tells you to do. I can't understand your association's stance though.

+1

Kind of hard to be expected to honor a contract with a entity that has proven to you that they do not intend to honor their part of the contract. Me? I do not do business that way, past the one time it takes me to see the other party has no honor.

[Jurassic Referee]

Originally Posted by ref2coach

+1

Kind of hard to be expected to honor a contract with a entity that has proven to you that they do not intend to honor their part of the contract. Me? I do not do business that way, past the one time it takes me to see the other party has no honor.

The expectation was bi-yearly pay raises of $3/official every 2 years starting in 2007. Nothing has been done to date. It was already explained in the one story linked that there are no contracts with any individual officials in La and no officials are employed by the LHSAA. The contracts are with different associations. And if an association can't find enough sub-contractors to meet committments, oh well.

[Eastshire]

Originally Posted by Jurassic Referee

The expectation was bi-yearly pay raises of $3/official every 2 years starting in 2007. Nothing has been done to date. It was already explained in the one story linked that there are no contracts with any individual officials in La and no officials are employed by the LHSAA. The contracts are with different associations. And if an association can't find enough sub-contractors to meet committments, oh well.

I see. So the individual referees may be out of Dodge, but it certainly won't be "oh well" for the associations. They will face fines for lack of performance on their contractual obligations. This probably ends with all the current associations having to dissolve in order to not pay thousands of dollars in damages to the state association (or whoever they contract with).

My point is this is not a real strike (as a real strike involves a union and an employer) and the associations do not enjoy the protections the law provides to striking unions.

And if the state has not met it's contractual obligations in regards to a pay raise, sue them, but defaulting on your contract is always going to end up biting you in the butt.

[Jurassic Referee]

Originally Posted by Eastshire

I see. So the individual referees may be out of Dodge, but it certainly won't be "oh well" for the associations. They will face fines for lack of performance on their contractual obligations. This probably ends with all the current associations having to dissolve in order to not pay thousands of dollars in damages to the state association (or whoever they contract with).

My point is this is not a real strike (as a real strike involves a union and an employer) and the associations do not enjoy the protections the law provides to striking unions.

And if the state has not met it's contractual obligations in regards to a pay raise, sue them, but defaulting on your contract is always going to end up biting you in the butt.

I'm not a lawyer but I think a lot would depend on the nature of the contract signed. Unless one of those associations is completely clueless, they should have some rider in their contract re:availability of people willing to work at any specific time.

Nope, this isn't a strike of any kind. It's an uprising.

Seriously, neither the LHSAA or the various officials associations can force their members to work. That why somewhere along the line the LHSAA needs to sit down and straighten things out. Unless I'm reading all of those newspaper links wrong, the officials thought they had come to some kind of an agreement back in 2007.

[Eastshire]

Originally Posted by Jurassic Referee

I'm not a lawyer but I think a lot would depend on the nature of the contract signed. Unless one of those associations is completely clueless, they should have some rider in their contract re:availability of people willing to work at any specific time.

That depends on how good their lawyers are.

Nope, this isn't a strike of any kind. It's an uprising.

And long overdue at that

Seriously, neither the LHSAA or the various officials associations can force their members to work. That why somewhere along the line the LHSAA needs to sit down and straighten things out. Unless I'm reading all of those newspaper links wrong, the officials thought they had come to some kind of an agreement back in 2007.

That's true, but the courts can enforce contracts. What they may end up entailing I can't say for sure but it's not likely to be pleasant for the associations, especially if they are instructing officials not to work.

I agree that LHSAA needs to step up to their 2007 agreement and get with the program.

[Judtech]

Originally Posted by Eastshire

I see. So the individual referees may be out of Dodge, but it certainly won't be "oh well" for the associations. They will face fines for lack of performance on their contractual obligations. This probably ends with all the current associations having to dissolve in order to not pay thousands of dollars in damages to the state association (or whoever they contract with).

My point is this is not a real strike (as a real strike involves a union and an employer) and the associations do not enjoy the protections the law provides to striking unions.

And if the state has not met it's contractual obligations in regards to a pay raise, sue them, but defaulting on your contract is always going to end up biting you in the butt.

To elaborate on this point: The officials/sub contractors make up the Associations who contracted with the Schools.
So say for instance the "Bayou Officials Association" or BOA signs a contract to cover games for the "Riverboat District" games at such and such a rate and all that other fine stuff. (SIDEBAR: I can't BELIEVE there is no fine print detailing the fines and penalties of BOC by either party in the contracts) The BOA's obviously determines they have enough officials in their stable to meet the contract b4 signing.
Now if the BOA's officials get "Stripe Sickness" and don't work that would cause the BOA to be unable to cover the games they are contractually obligated to cover in the Riverboat District. It is the BOA who will take the heat not the officials.
HOWEVER, and this is "the rub", what happens if/when the labor dispute gets resolved? If the BOA is found in BOC with the Riverboat District, there will most likely be damages (def. compensatory and maybe punitive) awarded the Riverboat District that the BOA is responsible for paying. Now, the BOA is getting paid $75/game and all the officials are happy. Unfortunately for them, the BOA is still on the hook for the damages caused by the "sub contractors" which caused the BOA to be in BOC with the RD. (Say THAT 10xs fast!) What is the BOA to do? One option would be to raise whatever fees they charge their members/sub contractors to be members of the BOA. They could file bankruptcy, which then causes a whole BUNCH of issues. Or they could just dissolve the BOA. However, that would necessitate a new association being formed, and may cause angst with the Schools as they will now NOT be getting money from the "old" association and still having to pay higher rates to the "new" assocaition (Cue WHO song)
Now, if the "sub contractors" continued to work under the existing contract until it expires all of that is moot. When the schools come around with a "new" contract offer for a whopping $36.50 + a glass of water, the BOA can say thank you but no thank you to the schools. If EVERY association does this, the schools will then have to 1) SERIOUSLY negotiate a new deal with the association 2) Re Vamp how they obtain their officials. So instead of contracting with an association, they contract with individuals or 3) Have the players call their own! Finally, the BOA would not be on the hook for any damages caused the schools and the schools would NOT have a bargaining chip (fines, damages etc) they can use in contract negotiations with the BOA.

Yep, I still like JAR's thought process.

[26 Year Gap]

I guess if associations have contracts with certain schools or districts, that certain other associations shouldn't be poaching those contracts thinking that if they work those games they might get more contracts down the line. If they want to work their own games, that is one thing, but going to other areas is just plain wrong IMO.