Chewing Gum

[Jurassic Referee]

Originally posted by scottk_61
Coaches will use anything to gain an advantage, and gum is one of them.
I don't allow it, if I see it you have to get rid of it.

About all I can say is "WOW"!!

[zebraman]

Coaches will use anything to gain an advantage, and gum is one of them. I don't allow it, if I see it you have to get rid of it. If you have a problem with gum (that I didn't see) then leave the court, give me a sub and we will play ball.

Amen to the "wow" comment. Have you honestly seen a coach use gum to their advantage?

IMHO, if you are making players get rid of their gum, then you are looking for trouble. Look hard enough and you'll find it.

Z

[Tim C]

Besides being a little OOO please answer the earlier question:

Under what Federation or NCAA rule do you ban gum?

Just wondering.

[scottk_61]

To answer a few of the questions,,,,,,
I have seen a coach direct a player to "drop" their gum on the court during a particularly heavy set of breaks, in order to give their players a rest.
"Look Ref, there is gum on the floor, we gotta get that up." From a 5A school. Have seen it happen many times over the years.
Have a choking episode to slow down the action.
Player B5 appears to choke and takes a knee around mid-court.
"Hey Ref, that kid is hurt!" From a repetitive state finals team. Happened over 10 years ago and last year while I was watching, not working.

If you haven't seen the cheap tricks, then you haven't seen the amount of ball that I have.

What rule do I use to justify my actions if forbidding gum?
Rule 2 Section 3

Like my old assignor used to say, "If you ain't got the balls to make the call, get off of the floor. The tough calls that are unpopular will tell you if you want to work a game or have the game worked on you."

[rainmaker]

Originally posted by scottk_61

Like my old assignor used to say, "If you ain't got the balls to make the call....."

Onions, Scott. Around here, folks carry their courage in their onions.

[Jurassic Referee]

Originally posted by scottk_61
If you haven't seen the cheap tricks, then you haven't seen the amount of ball that I have.

What rule do I use to justify my actions if forbidding gum?
Rule 2 Section 3

Like my old assignor used to say, "If you ain't got the balls to make the call, get off of the floor. The tough calls that are unpopular will tell you if you want to work a game or have the game worked on you." [/B]

Scott,don't you think that,sometime since they hung up the ol' peach baskets,the rulesmakers in NFHS,NCAA,NBA,FIBA,etc. would have put in a rule if they thought gum chewing was dangerous or a problem? There never has been such a rule EVER in ANY of the rulesets!That should tell you all you need to know right there.

Rule 2-3 wasn't put there for officials to make up their own rules according to their own personal biases.Over the last 44 years that I've officiated,I have neither used R2-3,nor have I ever seen it invoked.Also,as an "old" assignor myself,I would be awful leary of any official that would invoke this rule for something like gum chewing.Where do you think you are going to stand with any league you are working in,if they don't agree with you that chewing gum is a safety issue? This whole scenario has nothing to do with having "balls" as an official.It does have something to do with using a little common sense before you start WW3.

You really should find yourself another windmill to tilt at!

[scottk_61]

This whole scenario has nothing to do with having "balls" as an official.It does have something to do with using a little common sense before you start WW3.

Hmm, I have never had any conflict with any coach in over 20 years of officiating for forbidding chewing gum.
I have seen more flak than I would have ever thought of on the rubberband issue, though.

You have to understand, at the pre-game, I tell them to get rid of it and they do. No arguements, no questions.
A simple, "Tell your players no gum while on the court, please." and the issue is over.
Maybe it is in how I apprach it, another facet of game management.
The association that I have joined recently after moving has also advised that we tell the coaches and team captains, "no gum or candy"
I have been a member of 7 different state high school associations in the last 20 years and this has been a standard thing. Frankly I am surprised to see that it is not pretty uniform in approach nationally.
Adult rec ball is another matter, some of those programs allow the players to smoke while sitting on the bench!

[ChuckElias]

Originally posted by rainmaker

Onions, Scott. Around here, folks carry their courage in their onions.

No, no, Juulie. I think you misunderstood. He means literal basketballs. If you don't have a ball on the court, then how can you play? So if you don't have the balls (the game ball and a back-up), you might as well get off the court, b/c the teams won't be able to play anyway.

That's what he meant, right?

Chuck

[Brian Watson]

Originally posted by scottk_61
To answer a few of the questions,,,,,,
I have seen a coach direct a player to "drop" their gum on the court during a particularly heavy set of breaks, in order to give their players a rest.
"Look Ref, there is gum on the floor, we gotta get that up." From a 5A school. Have seen it happen many times over the years.
Have a choking episode to slow down the action.
Player B5 appears to choke and takes a knee around mid-court.
"Hey Ref, that kid is hurt!" From a repetitive state finals team. Happened over 10 years ago and last year while I was watching, not working.

If you haven't seen the cheap tricks, then you haven't seen the amount of ball that I have.

What rule do I use to justify my actions if forbidding gum?
Rule 2 Section 3

Like my old assignor used to say, "If you ain't got the balls to make the call, get off of the floor. The tough calls that are unpopular will tell you if you want to work a game or have the game worked on you."

Soooo....If a player refused to spit out his gum, you would call the game?

It looks like we stumbled into a pretty emotional issue. I guess a state association or conf. could ban chewing gum, but, I still don't see where in the rules we can keep them from having it. The elastic rule is a pretty weak defense. I could tell a kid with knee high white socks with yellow and blue stipes around the top he cannot play because it is a safty hazzard, but I would never do that...

If a coach is abusing it, write the facts up and let the state deal with it. But, we cannot read their minds so I don't know how you would prove they sent a kid into pretend to choke. I mean, if the coach is really doing it on purpose and you take away their gum what would stop them from faking a "groin" injury or a ankle twist, how will you stop that? We cannot legislate everything.

[bard]

Please tell me under what NFHS or NCAA rule that gives the officials the authority to tell players that they cannot chew gum while playing?

I think it's pretty straight forward from some officials, Mark. This falls under Safety Concerns, 3-7. While 3-7 specifies hair and fingernails, it clearly does not rule out gum.

Although, personally, I have no problem with gum if it stays in the mouth!

[DownTownTonyBrown]

Earlier Scott said:

I have seen a coach direct a player to "drop" their gum on the court during a particularly heavy set of breaks, in order to give their players a rest. "Look Ref, there is gum on the floor, we gotta get that up."

Number 1 I don't like kids telling me what I "gotta" do. But man, if you've got that kind of evidence ("seen a coach direct a player to drop their gum"). T- the manipulative prick. T- the kid too, if you like. This is surely unsportsman-like play.

Then he said:
Have a choking episode to slow down the action. Player B5 appears to choke and takes a knee around mid-court. "Hey Ref, that kid is hurt!"

In my opinon, if you are certain this is a ploy, either play on and see how quickly he recuperates, or show your concern by requiring the coach to make a substitution. And don't back off when he is all better 15 seconds later. Require the substitution. "I still need a sub and you've only got 15 second left before I T-bone you."

Of what you have said, I think the preventive officiating is the best choice. If you don't want it in your game, show your safety concern by discussing it in the pregame. Then you have established the basis for having it removed during the game.

Because, rule-wise, I don't think you have a leg to stand on. There are many things on the court that are dangerous. We can't arbitrarily remove some of them and let other's be accepted. If we start that, then you have created a liability for yourself - you felt one thing was a safety concern and you removed it. Someone else feels and proves that something else is a safety concern and you have not removed it. A player gets hurt. You're getting paid; you're making up rules as you see fit; your game is not strictly abiding by the written rules; you're liable. We only have the rules to work within.

[scottk_61]

Any time I have had a player found with gum, he goes out of the game until the problem is rectified. More often than not, they will swallow it.
The old fake injury thing has been around forever, I always have concern for player safety, thus a substitution is going to be required.....if the player is down, the coach is coming out at my request.
You know what I mean?

I am really amazed at the vociferous objection to establishing your own authority to control the game by members here.
If you think it is a problem, don't allow it. We did this before the rule was established for the fingernail issue (when was that?).

Staying ahead of possible trouble is part of game management.
Call your game and it will be your game.

[Oz Referee]

Besides the fact that I am totally amazed that any referee would possibly tell a player to remove gum, I think the big issue here is the risk to other players.

From what I can tell, all other rules governing allowable equipment is designed to protect players from injury - specifically players other than those with the equipment.

Can anyone explain to me how on earth chewing gum could injure any player other than the one chewing it? Surely if the player chewing the gum is made aware of the risk (ie choking) and chooses to chew gum, then there is no reason to prevent them from chewing gum.

[scottk_61]

Oz, like I have said, you call your game.
I routinely do over 100 HS Varsity games a season, not to mention the JV and middle school games that go along with each school year.
Hell, I don't allow college players to chew gum either.
Adult ball is another matter.
To those who are so adamnant in saying that it is wrong, then you have either never had a problem, are unaware, or are scared to take a stand against the game delaying issues of gum on the floor and needless risk to a player.

I didn't bring up the original subject, so I can't be the only one who has a question about it, now can I?

Just for the record, I dont' allow rubber bands either. That arguement is still going on also.

[Dan_ref]

Originally posted by scottk_61

I routinely do over 100 HS Varsity games a season, not to mention the JV and middle school games that go along with each school year.
Hell, I don't allow college players to chew gum either.
Adult ball is another matter.

How does this happen? 100 HS V + college + adult
rec league? (Maybe I ain't working hard enough?)

FWIW, if a player wants to chew gum I ain't gonna be the
guy who tells him to spit it out. If you're athletic enough
to chew gum & walk you're welcome to stay in my game.