Messy situation

[deecee]

Why can you NOT change a foul or uncall a T? We do it on out of bounds all the time. Last year I called a charge because I was straight lined and didnt see the defender push the offensive player into the other defender. My partner just didnt blow a whistle but after I made the call told me what happened. Seemed only right to change from charge to push.

Also couple years ago a head coach had a heart attack in a college game and the officials didnt know what was going on and charged the coach with a T. The NCAA suspended them and said they should have rescinded the T. We can do whatever we please as long as its within the rules and it makes sense.

Here rescinding the T makes perfect sense.

[Eastshire]

Originally Posted by deecee

Why can you NOT change a foul or uncall a T? We do it on out of bounds all the time. Last year I called a charge because I was straight lined and didnt see the defender push the offensive player into the other defender. My partner just didnt blow a whistle but after I made the call told me what happened. Seemed only right to change from charge to push.

Also couple years ago a head coach had a heart attack in a college game and the officials didnt know what was going on and charged the coach with a T. The NCAA suspended them and said they should have rescinded the T. We can do whatever we please as long as its within the rules and it makes sense.

Here rescinding the T makes perfect sense.

There is a difference between conferring with your partner after a preliminary signal and going back to a foul that was assessed prior to the last live ball. You can only go back to fix correctable errors and this isn't a correctable error.

Rescinding the T would not be within the rules.

[BillyMac]

Originally Posted by deecee

Why can you not uncall a T?

Coach requests, and is granted a timeout. Official home scorekeeper states that it is his sixth time out. Official charges team with a technical foul. Before shots are taken, the official home scorekeeper, and the visiting scorekeeper, confer and decide that an error was made in the offcial home scorebook, and that the coach did not use a timeout in excess of the limit.

Call me a fool, but I'm taking back the charged techincal foul.

[Adam]

Originally Posted by BillyMac

Coach requests, and is granted a timeout. Official home scorekeeper states that it is his sixth time out. Official charges coach with a technical foul. Before shots are taken, the official home scorekeeper, and the visiting scorekeeper, confer and decide that an error was made in the offcial home scorebook, and that the coach did not use a timeout in excess of the limit.

Call me a fool, but I'm taking back the charged techincal foul.

How about after the first FT?

[BillyMac]

Originally Posted by Snaqwells

How about after the first FT?

Correctable error? Unmerited free throw?

[Eastshire]

Originally Posted by BillyMac

Correctable error? Unmerited free throw?

The penalty for a T is 2 free throws and the ball to the opponent. Since a T was called, even though it was called in error, the free throw is merited.

[Eastshire]

Originally Posted by BillyMac

Coach requests, and is granted a timeout. Official home scorekeeper states that it is his sixth time out. Official charges coach with a technical foul. Before shots are taken, the official home scorekeeper, and the visiting scorekeeper, confer and decide that an error was made in the offcial home scorebook, and that the coach did not use a timeout in excess of the limit.

Call me a fool, but I'm taking back the charged techincal foul.

First, I hope the official charged the team, not the coach, with the T.

Second, yes if the free throw has not yet been taken, you're not too late to fix it. If, however, the free throw has been taken, what's done is done.

An interesting question would be if the team would still have a time out left since they paid a T for their 5th timeout.

[Adam]

Originally Posted by Eastshire

An interesting question would be if the team would still have a time out left since they paid a T for their 5th timeout.

I would say they do. This situation isn't specifically addressed, so I'd be willing to fall back on 2-3 here.

[deecee]

Originally Posted by Eastshire

First, I hope the official charged the team, not the coach, with the T.

Second, yes if the free throw has not yet been taken, you're not too late to fix it. If, however, the free throw has been taken, what's done is done.

An interesting question would be if the team would still have a time out left since they paid a T for their 5th timeout.

Why can you not? These were unmerited free throws. Wipe them off then rescind the T. Done. And it will be done in my game because it sure as hell is the right thing to do.

[Eastshire]

Originally Posted by deecee

Why can you not? These were unmerited free throws. Wipe them off then rescind the T. Done. And it will be done in my game because it sure as hell is the right thing to do.

They are merited free throws. Free throws are correctly awarded when a T has been called. You can't go back and wipe off a foul after play resumes even if you were wrong to assess it in the first place.

An unmerited free throw is a free throw that is unwarranted based on the foul called. Examples include awarding one and a bonus prior to the offending teams seventh team foul or awarding a second free throw after a missed first throw before the tenth team foul.

Sometimes we kick it. When we do, it's important to understand what we can and cannot fix. While I appreciate your motives, the rules do not allow us to fix this error.

[rwest]

Originally Posted by Eastshire

First, I hope the official charged the team, not the coach, with the T.

Second, yes if the free throw has not yet been taken, you're not too late to fix it. If, however, the free throw has been taken, what's done is done.

An interesting question would be if the team would still have a time out left since they paid a T for their 5th timeout.

What rule reference that states we can't fix this after the first free throw?

[just another ref]

What says we can't rescind a technical foul? Ref passes a glaring coach, as he turns away, he hears "You suck!" He whistles, signals, and reports a technical foul on the coach. His partner then tells him the actual speaker was a fan behind the bench.

Must we shoot then?

[zm1283]

Originally Posted by RookieDude

...have you told the ol' boy you officiated with this?

Yes. Sent him a text this morning and admitted I was wrong and told him I think I'm still right about the rest of it.

I'm of the thinking that there is no rule that says we can't rescind a T, so if we need to do it, then do it.

[Adam]

Originally Posted by just another ref

What says we can't rescind a technical foul? Ref passes a glaring coach, as he turns away, he hears "You suck!" He whistles, signals, and reports a technical foul on the coach. His partner then tells him the actual speaker was a fan behind the bench.

Must we shoot then?

No. I've had this scenario, but where the person who stated "that was a crappy call" was one of the officials for the next game sitting behind the coach.
The difference was the T was rescinded before any FTs were shot.
Let me ask this. Is there any action that the rules say can be taken back after the penalty has been enforced? No, there's not.

[Eastshire]

Originally Posted by rwest

What rule reference that states we can't fix this after the first free throw?

Do you see Ts on the list of correctable errors, because I don't.