free throw

[Upward ref]

Went to observe my peers tues. night. BV; With about 5 mnutes left in the last quarter, during the first shot of a two shot free throw for visiting team, home HC has all 5 players huddle up for a short time out , (first two and last two lane spaces unoccupied) and then the home players return for the second shot . I'm looking for a violation signal but we play on instead . Am i correct ?

[Adam]

This should not have been allowed, period.

Instruct the coach that he needs to have two players on the lane. If he refuses, it's a T.
10-1-5b

[BktBallRef]

Originally Posted by Upward ref

Went to observe my peers tues. night. BV; With about 5 mnutes left in the last quarter, during the first shot of a two shot free throw for visiting team, home HC has all 5 players huddle up for a short time out , (first two and last two lane spaces unoccupied) and then the home players return for the second shot . I'm looking for a violation signal but we play on instead . Am i correct ?

No, it's not a violation. You have a technical foul.

The first two lane space must be occupied by the opponents. The FTs cannot be shot without those spots being occupied.

[Raymond]

Originally Posted by Upward ref

Went to observe my peers tues. night. BV; With about 5 mnutes left in the last quarter, during the first shot of a two shot free throw for visiting team, home HC has all 5 players huddle up for a short time out , (first two and last two lane spaces unoccupied) and then the home players return for the second shot . I'm looking for a violation signal but we play on instead . Am i correct ?

Well, I know you weren't at my game. You need to shoot me an PM.

[Welpe]

It would be a violation following a timeout or intermission.

See case book play 9.1.2 Situation A.

[Upward ref]

Originally Posted by Welpe

It would be a violation following a timeout or intermission.

See case book play 9.1.2 Situation A.

OK , but there was no delay really.In my OP, A-1,2,3,4,5, all just rotted over to their bench before the first f t , then trotted on back and lined up for the second throw before it was administered. I've been studying and can't seem to find it in the tech. fouls, thats why I thought it was a violation. Rule 9-1 penalties don't address it ,other than mentioning 8-1-4-(c) restrictions. 8.1.4.c has a violation for "improper alignment" with an offensive player in a defensive lane space, not a T.
1) Would it be a team T, a direct on the coach or what? citation please
( I can't see a coach refusing after being told )Our assoc. teaches a lot of preventive officiating ,but what if my partner or I didn't think to warn the coach ? Or my partner or I administered the free throw too fast without warning the coach?


thanks

[Welpe]

Originally Posted by Upward ref

OK , but there was no delay really.

Sure there was. Team B has to occupy the bottom two lane spaces. In your play, we can't shoot until they do.

Direct team b to occupy the space and if they refuse, it is a team technical for delay of game. If you are coming out of a time out or intermission, you use the resumption of play procedure instead.

Case play 10.1.5 Situation C fits your play.

[BktBallRef]

Originally Posted by Upward ref

OK , but there was no delay really.In my OP, A-1,2,3,4,5, all just rotted over to their bench before the first f t , then trotted on back and lined up for the second throw before it was administered. I've been studying and can't seem to find it in the tech. fouls, thats why I thought it was a violation. Rule 9-1 penalties don't address it ,other than mentioning 8-1-4-(c) restrictions. 8.1.4.c has a violation for "improper alignment" with an offensive player in a defensive lane space, not a T.
1) Would it be a team T, a direct on the coach or what? citation please
( I can't see a coach refusing after being told )Our assoc. teaches a lot of preventive officiating ,but what if my partner or I didn't think to warn the coach ? Or my partner or I administered the free throw too fast without warning the coach/

Very simply you do NOT administer the FT until the opponent occupies the two bottom spaces.

You ask for two players.

If you don't get them, it's a T.

10-1-5b & 10.1.5 SITUATION C (b)

[Forksref]

Originally Posted by BktBallRef

Very simply you do NOT administer the FT until the opponent occupies the two bottom spaces.

You ask for two players.

If you don't get them, it's a T.

10-1-5b & 10.1.5 SITUATION C (b)

An dat's da name a dat tune!

[hoopguy]

I agree with BktBallRef about how this should be handled and will do this but I do not think the rule and case are ideal for us, the officials. Basically, we are allowing the coach to huddle with his players until you ask for 2 players to fill the bottom lane spaces. We also do not have a clear sense of how long to allow the coach before responding to our request to send the 2 players to the fill the lane spaces. I believe the rule should be clearer and not allow the coach to huddle when he should not be allowed to. It seems like a loophole that coaches will and do use.

To continue with this thread... What happens when both teams huddle in this same situation where there is no time out? How should this be handled by officials?

[justacoach]

Originally Posted by hoopguy

To continue with this thread... What happens when both teams huddle in this same situation where there is no time out? How should this be handled by officials?

When you're ready to administer, ask for two players for bottom spots. Up to you if/when you serve the T.
There is no obligation for the shooting team to be present in the middle spots. If the middle spots are vacant, they may be occupied by members of the non-shooting team but only up to a maximum of 4 non-shooting players can occupy marked lane spaces, per FED. IIRC, NCAA does not permit non-shooting team to move to middle spots.

[Raymond]

Originally Posted by justacoach

When you're ready to administer, ask for two players for bottom spots. Up to you if/when you serve the T.
There is no obligation for the shooting team to be present in the middle spots. If the middle spots are vacant, they may be occupied by members of the non-shooting team but only up to a maximum of 4 non-shooting players can occupy marked lane spaces, per FED. IIRC, NCAA-W does not permit non-shooting team to move to middle spots.

Fixed that for you. No charge.

[BktBallRef]

Originally Posted by hoopguy

I agree with BktBallRef about how this should be handled and will do this but I do not think the rule and case are ideal for us, the officials. Basically, we are allowing the coach to huddle with his players until you ask for 2 players to fill the bottom lane spaces.

We allow a team to huddle in the lane until we're ready to administer. What's the difference? None.

We also do not have a clear sense of how long to allow the coach before responding to our request to send the 2 players to the fill the lane spaces. I believe the rule should be clearer and not allow the coach to huddle when he should not be allowed to. It seems like a loophole that coaches will and do use.

Our job is to get them on the lane. If they don't respond, hit the T. If you do your job, there is no loophole.

To continue with this thread... What happens when both teams huddle in this same situation where there is no time out? How should this be handled by officials?

You only need the shooter for Team A. Get him there or call the T.

[Indianaref]

I figure you would ignore the T if only one player left.

[Welpe]

Originally Posted by Indianaref

I figure you would ignore the T if only one player left.

I suppose...assuming that team actually has a chance of winning.